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b0se
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 Posted: Sat, 17th Mar 2012 21:39 Post subject: 5.1 Surround Sound |
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Asus Xonar D2/PM
Logitech z906
How does one manage to have 5.1 sound from every source ? Currently only Winamp/Games/Movies play 5.1 sound, unfortunately YouTube and other websites don't.
Any idea on how to work this out ?
[spoiler][quote="SteamDRM"]i've bought mohw :derp: / FPS of the year! [/quote]
[quote="SteamDRM"][quote="b0se"]BLACK OPS GOTY[/quote]
No.[/quote][/spoiler]
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sausje
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| Posted: Sat, 17th Mar 2012 22:16 Post subject: |
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Youtube doesn't support 5.1 asfar as i know
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b0se
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| Posted: Sat, 17th Mar 2012 22:22 Post subject: |
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The sound card should project 5.1 sound even if youtube is in 2.1
[spoiler][quote="SteamDRM"]i've bought mohw :derp: / FPS of the year! [/quote]
[quote="SteamDRM"][quote="b0se"]BLACK OPS GOTY[/quote]
No.[/quote][/spoiler]
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sausje
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| Posted: Sat, 17th Mar 2012 22:24 Post subject: |
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Well that is emulated, doubt that you would get the same quality in surround as with true 5.1
But i'm not 110% sure of this, so someone else with more knowledge about this should reply ^^
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Przepraszam
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| Posted: Sat, 17th Mar 2012 23:02 Post subject: |
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I think there is option somewhere like "Speaker Fill". Had Asus DS but never noticed for youtube videos
I have HT Omega Claro and I can hear just fine but sound is so shit..
but yea..play with your somethings, something must not be set correctly
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| Posted: Sat, 17th Mar 2012 23:57 Post subject: |
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You can't have 5.1 audio if the source does not output 5.1 itself, and for that it has to be recorded in 5.1. You can have emulation, but implementation is up to the specific hardware/software you are using. For example, AVRs have special modes that generate 5.1 audio from a stereo source (obviously not any good if compared to a true 5.1 source). Media players might have an "audio fill" option as mentioned, which tries to achieve the same thing, but again, this is not real 5.1 sound.
All in all, you can't have real 5.1 audio just because you have 5.1 speakers - you need a 5.1 source as well. Any emulation is either done at the source or via the media player (hardware or software). There is no global surround emulation on a driver level as far as I know.
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b0se
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Frant
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| Posted: Sun, 18th Mar 2012 01:54 Post subject: |
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| fuckit wrote: | | MinderMast wrote: | | There is no global surround emulation on a driver level as far as I know. |
wrong.
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CMSS-3D
"CMSS-3D recreates realistic surround sound from any audio source and puts you right in the center of the action, whether you are using multichannel speakers or headphones." CMSS-3D is a DSP feature that provides audio enhancement. Depending on the equipment used, CMSS-3D has 3 variants:[8]
CMSS-3D Headphone: When the Creative Control Panel is set to Headphones, this setting creates virtual 3D positional audio via synthesized binaural cues (see Sound localization and Head-related transfer function). If the application generating the audio uses a hardware-accelerated 3D audio API (i.e. DirectSound3D or OpenAL), the input for the binaural synthesis algorithms consists of up to 128 sound sources positioned arbitrarily in 3D space. If the application instead generates multi-channel sound directly (e.g. a media player app or a game with software-based audio processing), the input for the binaural synthesis algorithms consist of the 4 to 7 positional sound sources associated with the application's selected speaker configuration.
CMSS-3D Virtual (Stereo Xpand): When the Creative Control Panel is set to 2/2.1 or 4/4.1 speakers, this setting creates virtual 3D positional audio similar to CMSS-3DHeadphone. The difference is that this includes techniques such as crosstalk cancellation because sound from all speakers reaches BOTH ears which makes the binaural cues more complicated to synthesize. Additionally, the listener must be located in the "sweet spot" between all of the speakers for the effect to work properly. Note that this is not available (including MacroFX and ElevationFilter) when using 5.1 or more speakers. In these cases, 3D audio sources are mapped to speakers by manipulating the relative volume levels for the different speaker positions.
CMSS-3D Surround: When the Creative Control Panel is set to 4/4.1, 5.1, 6.1, or 7.1 speakers, this setting will upmix stereo sources to multiple channels. Note that both CMSS-3DSurround and CMSS-3DVirtual can be enabled when using 4/4.1 speakers.
And the function is virtually useless since it distorts the sound.
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| Posted: Sun, 18th Mar 2012 04:02 Post subject: |
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your point?
and.... i don't know about the distortion claim, do you have any sources or proof to cite for that? seems very convenient and baseless of a claim.
also, of course the listener must be located in the sweet spot, do you understand why you point your speakers towards yourself instead of at the walls? the same can be said for anything more than 2.1 output, if you don't sit in the sweet spot, it doesn't sound as good, that's why it's called that.
i never claimed that it provides accurate directional sound if that's what you're getting at, far from it, without support ingame or application or whatever for directional sound such as EAX or similar there's not really much that can be done without loads of extra calculating which direction the sound should be heard from.
it is true that there's no driver level surround emulation that is directional, but that's beside the point.
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| Posted: Sun, 18th Mar 2012 08:02 Post subject: |
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I guess it kinda slipped my mind that we are talking about a dedicated sound card here. Although perhaps even your typical Realtek onboard has some basic upmix function that just replicates the front channel on surround channels.
As fuckit said, this Asus card seems to have Dolby PLII support, which is decent enough (on my AVR at least), but I personally only find it useful for music. I have to switch audio output to stereo in windows sound options to make it work though. Otherwise the output is seen as 5.1 even if only 2 channels are actually used. I don't think it should be the same case with a sound card though.
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Werelds
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| Posted: Sun, 18th Mar 2012 11:24 Post subject: |
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I don't know how to set it up with the Xonars, but there is a difference between Surround Sound and 5.1. Surround just means it uses as many speakers as possible, whereas 5.1 implies that there actually are 6 channels, which each of the 6 having its own stream.
A 2.0 signal can be "upscaled" to 4.0 perfectly fine without distortion, with FR/RR and FL/RL outputting the same audio. Same goes for 2.1 to 4.1. That's simply upmixing and you can enforce that even in stuff like AC3Filter. Adding the ".1" to a simple stereo signal can also be done; the audio processor on the Xonar should be able to filter out some of the tones and send them to the sub. This is all simple emulation and I'm pretty sure even onboard crap can do that nowadays.
What you can not do, like I said, is create a true 4.1 (or better) signal from a stereo source. Theoretically it can be done by filtering out specific tones and only sending those to rear etcetera, but chances are that will fuck up how things sound.
As for CMSS-3D Surround: does not distort sound. The other two do, as they take in multi-channel sounds and merge them into stereo by using some clever tricks on the amplitude mostly. That said, it actually does work. The front channels aren't fucked with and the rear channels are quite literally just added in; because of how our ear works, the tricks they pull on those channels actually do make them sound like they're coming from behind. I use it all the time, helps me pinpoint where shit is coming from in MP pretty well in most games 
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b0se
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| Posted: Sun, 18th Mar 2012 12:51 Post subject: |
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All the DPS's in the Xonar CP are useless since they don't change a thing.
I have Hi-Fi/ GX/ Music/ Game/ Movie and clicking those doesn't change a thing.
[spoiler][quote="SteamDRM"]i've bought mohw :derp: / FPS of the year! [/quote]
[quote="SteamDRM"][quote="b0se"]BLACK OPS GOTY[/quote]
No.[/quote][/spoiler]
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| Posted: Sun, 18th Mar 2012 14:08 Post subject: |
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Hi-Fi is to ensure you have no DSP's enabled. That is the entire point of that button. That way if listening to stereo sources you can ensure it is being outputted as such.
No clue how to do whatever on the D2, but you need to keep stereo .. stereo. Applying a Dolby Virtual / Dolby Headphone (Or CMSS 3D on Creative cards) on a stereo source will ruin any stereophonic effects that trick your ears into hearing certain things.
Those other buttons are just equalizer settings. Don't ever touch them if you want to keep the audio sounding the way it should.
I use dolby headphone and dolby virtual for when I have a surround source as I use the STX and a high quality stereophonic setup. If you have 5.1/6.1/8.1 speakers then just make sure you have 6/8 speakers selected in the control center.
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b0se
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| Posted: Sun, 18th Mar 2012 14:31 Post subject: |
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Then I would leave it alone just like that. If you care about absolute fidelity you won't want to add anything.
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b0se
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| Posted: Sun, 18th Mar 2012 14:34 Post subject: |
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Okay, thanks guys.
[spoiler][quote="SteamDRM"]i've bought mohw :derp: / FPS of the year! [/quote]
[quote="SteamDRM"][quote="b0se"]BLACK OPS GOTY[/quote]
No.[/quote][/spoiler]
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| Posted: Sun, 18th Mar 2012 22:08 Post subject: |
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I have good 5.1 set but after a couple of years I unplugged 3 speakers and made it into 2.1 set... It is less troublesome. It never worked for me in pc environment. maybe some games like doom3 or bioshock but as far as 5.1 goes, Only home theatre setup...
Offcourse If You only have source stereo music or movie, You can alawys force it with drivers into dolby digital but its nothing special.
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| Posted: Sun, 18th Mar 2012 22:10 Post subject: |
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| KillerCrocker wrote: | I have good 5.1 set but after a couple of years I unplugged 3 speakers and made it into 2.1 set... It is less troublesome. It never worked for me in pc environment. maybe some games like doom3 or bioshock but as far as 5.1 goes, Only home theatre setup...
Offcourse If You only have source stereo music or movie, You can alawys force it with drivers into dolby digital but its nothing special. |
true enough and it's shameful how few games support 5.1 output in all honesty, but ones that do, i spook myself not being sure if a sound coming from behind me was the game or not sometimes.
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| Posted: Sun, 18th Mar 2012 23:24 Post subject: |
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Ive found cmss3d option to be underwhelming. It kinda lowered the sound and made it harder to focus on.
3080, ps5, lg oled
Sin317-"im 31 years old and still surprised at how much shit comes out of my ass actually ..."
SteamDRM-"Call of Duty is the symbol of the true perfection in every aspect. Call of Duty games are like Mozart's/Beethoven's symphonies"
deadpoetic-"are you new to the cyberspace?"
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