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Cheez-It
Posts: 1106
Location: Rochester, NY
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 Posted: Sat, 21st May 2005 09:06 Post subject: Are games (physically) addicting? |
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Are games (physically) addicting?
I'm very interested in finding out. I'm drawn more to CS (which I just quit 45 minutes ago for the 3rd time) than alcohol or any drugs...
I personally think it is, I want to find out if they've done studies to see if it releases enough dopamine at the nucleus accumbens to be classified as addictive...
Any thoughts?
Yes I haven't slept in many hours and am just making this thread because I'm sleep-deprived and insane.
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| Posted: Sat, 21st May 2005 09:07 Post subject: |
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Most likely it is more of a behaviour problem than anything else.
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Cheez-It
Posts: 1106
Location: Rochester, NY
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| Posted: Sat, 21st May 2005 09:14 Post subject: |
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When I get back to campus I can look through the libraries journal resources and prove you wrong 
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| Posted: Sat, 21st May 2005 09:17 Post subject: |
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I am sure there might be a different opinions in the Psychatric community on the issue.
What ever you do find, please do reveal all information, not only of information that would help to prove your point: that it is not your fault for playing games to the extent you are currenty playing games.
Sure games can give you an adrenaline rush, or such, or other stimuli, such as giving the player some reward for playing well, but this is found in playing sports as well, and other activities.
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Cheez-It
Posts: 1106
Location: Rochester, NY
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| Posted: Sat, 21st May 2005 09:23 Post subject: |
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Of course of course 
I'm talking about a physical addiction by the way... No psycho bullshit, just whether it increases dopamine release from the ventral tegmental area to the nucleus accumbens somehow...
From what I know of neuroscience, this article seems decent http://www.fair-play.se/source.php/32761/VG%20Addiction%20Chapter.pdf (as non-technical as it is...)
"From the sparse research, it is evident that
video games appear to be at least potentially addictive.
There is also a need for a general taxonomy of video
games, as it could be the case that particular types of
games are more addictive than others. Another major
problem is that video games can be played in many different
ways, including on hand held consoles, on a personal
computer, home video game consoles, on arcade
machines, and on the Internet. It may be the case that
some of these media for playing games (such as in an
arcade or on the Internet) may be more addictive because
of other factors salient to that medium (e.g., disinhibition
on the Internet). Therefore, future research
needs to distinguish"
and then of course you have to factor in that some people are much more susceptible to addiction than others (reasons why some people can quit things easily while others find it impossible or cant stop without coming back...)
Theres a little too much psych bullshit in that article... but the conclusion is logical
I'll get some actual sources in about... 2 weeks lol.
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| Posted: Sat, 21st May 2005 09:25 Post subject: |
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| Martinius wrote: |
Sure games can give you an adrenaline rush, or such, or other stimuli, such as giving the player some reward for playing well, but this is found in playing sports as well, and other activities. |
So maybe that just means sports and other activities are physically addicting as well.
I voted yes, because I have a very hard time tearing myself away from games to do chores or go to class or even spend time with my wife. And when I am not playing games, I am thinking about them, and when I sleep I dream that I am in them. Last night I dreamt I was in garrys mod for HL2. I fear what will happen when we have a child. Seriously.
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| Posted: Sat, 21st May 2005 09:29 Post subject: |
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Bah everything is adicting poor me, it is not my fault!
Last edited by m2rock on Sat, 21st May 2005 20:08; edited 1 time in total
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Mutantius
VIP Member
Posts: 18594
Location: In Elektro looking for beans
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| Posted: Sat, 21st May 2005 10:42 Post subject: |
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I use play on my pc/xbox more than I watch TV, Its not because Im addicted the internet and games provide me with what I want to watch/read/do whereas I have to sit through a load of crap that doesnt intrest me if I decide to watch TV.
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| Posted: Sat, 21st May 2005 13:00 Post subject: |
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Imo it's not physically addicting.
Physcologically tho, is an almost definite. It fufills so many of our basic desires so well (compared to crack or drugs).
You might want to read up on this article:
http://www.gamasutra.com/features/20050426/hejdenberg_pfv.htm
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Cheez-It
Posts: 1106
Location: Rochester, NY
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| Posted: Sat, 21st May 2005 20:00 Post subject: |
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Martinius: all drugs of addiction work to increase dopamine release in the nucleus accumbens, the central piece of the rewards loop in your brain. However, many things have been found to be addicting, controlled studies have shown that extreme excersize and starvation can cause this extra dopamine release (one reason why anorexia is so difficult to "cure" (patients with anorexia show a lower level of dopamine release in the striatal area, which is thought to be why they will under eat or excersize too much, to increase the level of dopamine released... This lower dopamine seems to be a common factor in all addictions, it seems like it predisposes people to it..) anyways, many things can cause an increase in dopamine in this circuit, so why not video games? they're a very pleasurable activity... I think it also depends on the game... games like CS and MMORPG's seem a lot more addictive... I can't think of any reason why they wouldn't cause a similar increase in dopamine... anyways... There is no such thing as "psychologically addicting" Marijuana is not psychologically addicting, its physically addicting (binds to cannabinoid receptors resulting in an increase in dopamine release in the nucleus accumbens, forgot the exact mechanism...) anyways... yeah... I'll get more info as soon as I can.
ps if I rambled it's because I just woke up and can't think straight yet
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| Posted: Sat, 21st May 2005 20:06 Post subject: |
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I understand, but nearly anything can be then "Addicting" such as when runners run for a long run and get a good kick. And when I stated "psycholigically adicting" i meant it as a "behaviour problem"
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Dunge
Posts: 1201
Location: Québec
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| Posted: Sat, 21st May 2005 20:43 Post subject: |
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Physically? What, do you think that game CDs are covered in heroin or something? Video games are obviously not physically addictive because you don't interact with them physically.
Maybe you should look up the difference between "physical addiction" and "psychological addiction."
Rob
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Cheez-It
Posts: 1106
Location: Rochester, NY
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| Posted: Sat, 21st May 2005 21:31 Post subject: |
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Pluvius : thank you for your intelligent contribution
I already finished a major in Psychology and am now finishing up a major in BCS (concentrating in Neurobiology...)... Please.
Heroin doesn't even act directly on the nucleus accumbens, it binds to opioid receptors which inhibits GABA cells from firing (GABA is an inhibitory neurotransmitter) and thus inhibits inhibition of dopamine... thus increasing dopamine release...
Why do you think other circuits activated by a pleasurable activity such as playing a videogame or some specific event in the videogame couldn't somehow activate the rewards circuit in an indirect way? ... I think it could.
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| Posted: Sat, 21st May 2005 21:43 Post subject: |
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I don't care what courses you profess to have studied, people do not get withdrawal symptoms if they discontinue playing computer games. Therefore it is not physiologically addicting.
"Techniclly speaking, Beta-Manboi didnt inject Burberry_Massi with Benz, he injected him with liquid that had air bubbles in it, which caused benz." - House M.D
"Faith without logic is the same as knowledge without understanding; meaningless"
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Cheez-It
Posts: 1106
Location: Rochester, NY
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| Posted: Sat, 21st May 2005 21:47 Post subject: |
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Good point, but other things that are known to be addictive such as over eating (in obesity) and starvation or strenuous excersize (contributes to anorexia) will not result in withdrawal if taken away...
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| Posted: Sat, 21st May 2005 21:57 Post subject: |
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| Cheez-It wrote: | | Good point, but other things that are known to be addictive such as over eating (in obesity) and starvation or strenuous excersize (contributes to anorexia) will not result in withdrawal if taken away... |
But they are psychologically addictive, people do them because they enjoy the effects, rather then to relieve withdrawal symptoms.
I do agree that games can be addictive, psychologically. But thats no big deal, as people can get addicted to almost anything, even pain for some weirdos.
The thing is that people only consider it an addiction when it causes harm to the individual, which is where the definition of addiction has been skewed.
"Techniclly speaking, Beta-Manboi didnt inject Burberry_Massi with Benz, he injected him with liquid that had air bubbles in it, which caused benz." - House M.D
"Faith without logic is the same as knowledge without understanding; meaningless"
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Ispep
VIP Member
Posts: 4117
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| Posted: Sun, 22nd May 2005 00:10 Post subject: |
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Games can be harmful; they can isolate young children who prefer it to proper socialization with other kids of their age - at an important stage of their life no less. Although, it is possible this might not be the case as much as it used to be in my day (as games are presumably becoming more acceptable), but then that is just one example that came to me immediately when reading your post.
I'm sure there are others, though I agree it's not a powerful or dangerous addiction, I'm positive it has addictive properties, of that there is no doubt (the same can be said of practically everything).
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| Posted: Sun, 22nd May 2005 01:16 Post subject: |
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Well, first of all you don't need to physically interact with something to get a physical addiction. Think of the physical addiction as a "chain reaction": you don't need to interact with the body of a woman to obtain an erection, and a single word, in some occasions, can cause a heart attack. Neuronal activity IS a physical process, even though people tend to separate mind and body. Medicine often defies common sense.
I dont want to bother anyone saying how I can be so sure about it, what courses I have studied and so on (I am usually discrete and mind my own business): it is scientifically demonstrated, end of the story.
Nonetheless, I agree with most of you when you claim that "anything can be addictive". I think it's a right assumption. The problem is that the word "addiction" means all and nothing. Such a vague term should be split into two: on one hand serious and direct physical addiction (i.e. drugs), on the other indirect physical addiction (potentially, anything).
That's my absolutely personal opinion on the matter.
Being a lamer is a skill
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upstart_69
Posts: 1094
Location: Right behind you!
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| Posted: Sun, 22nd May 2005 03:13 Post subject: |
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games are a simple escape, nothing more. there are people who take games, or other means to escape reality, to the extreme, harming themselves by cutting off other healthy interactions. my personal opinion on the matter(which is all mr college educated smarty pants man has, as he has no factual evidence or studies to show otherwise) is that if a person has serious issues they will find a way to escape, through games or otherwise. however other things such as drugs and alcohol are COMPLETELY different because they themselves contain chemicals which make a person, unnaturally happy. games dont have this. therefore, if a person becomes well again they wont need them to escape from reality. however, the need for drugs is a problem in itself which will not go away until it is treated.
there are medical/psychological treatments in hospitals for drug addiction, there is no, and will never be a treatment for game addiction.
IN OTHER WORDS people need to stop their damn worrying and blaming other stuff for their problems.
sheesh.
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Cheez-It
Posts: 1106
Location: Rochester, NY
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| Posted: Sun, 22nd May 2005 05:10 Post subject: |
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Thanks for the constructive replies
upstart: Yes, it's an opinion... I pointedly said I had no proof in my first posts I said I would be looking into it further when I return to campus and have access to some science journals... But logically, from everything I have read, there is a strong possibility that games could be addictive, albeit, it would only impact people very predisposed to addictions as videogames obviously wouldn't have as strong an effect on the release of dopamine as drugs which for the most part directly increase the amount of dopamine available for binding at the nucleus accumbens.
In any case, yeah, saying videogames could possibly be physically addicting is an "opinion" but given that other things not directly injected into your body can cause an addiction by somehow increasing dopamine, then wouldn't you logically conclude that it's at least possible with video games?
PS: uhm. all drugs which can cause addiction do not make a person "unnaturally happy"...
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| Posted: Sun, 22nd May 2005 08:34 Post subject: |
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Cheez it dont you think it can be both? For some it is a behavioural problem and for others it might be that they are more likely for the brain to get a kick of out it like some runners runners get from running?
Cheers
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Cheez-It
Posts: 1106
Location: Rochester, NY
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| Posted: Sun, 22nd May 2005 08:40 Post subject: |
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Oh martinius definately, i just wanted to know if anyone knew like... proof that it definately was possible to be physically addicting, it's not an addiction for most people... but guys like that one who died from starvation or malnutrition or whatever from playing a mmorpg... you would be hard pressed to conclude that wasnt addiction so yeah i agree
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TiHKAL
Posts: 2350
Location: The Pub
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| Posted: Sun, 22nd May 2005 11:04 Post subject: |
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Too lazy to read the above posts
-----------------------------------------
Oppinion (Drunken) no game could ever be physically addictive (current and past games). However, a game could quite easily be psychologically addictive.
PC: i7-4790k @ 4.4, 32GB @ 2400, Nvidia 1080TI FE, 2 TB Crucial MX500 SSD
Nintendo Switch SX OS Pro / PS4 Pro 5.05 Hen/Mira / PS3 Modded / Wii Modded / 360 Pre-Wave4 mod
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TiHKAL
Posts: 2350
Location: The Pub
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| Posted: Sun, 22nd May 2005 11:08 Post subject: |
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Physical Addiction
---------------------
your body needs it!
Pyschological
------------------
you body thinks you need it!
PC: i7-4790k @ 4.4, 32GB @ 2400, Nvidia 1080TI FE, 2 TB Crucial MX500 SSD
Nintendo Switch SX OS Pro / PS4 Pro 5.05 Hen/Mira / PS3 Modded / Wii Modded / 360 Pre-Wave4 mod
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| Posted: Sun, 22nd May 2005 22:25 Post subject: |
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| The Wronged wrote: | | Well, first of all you don't need to physically interact with something to get a physical addiction. |
Actually, that's part of the definition of the term.
Since no one else seems to be willing to do the work:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Addiction#Varied_forms_of_addiction
The community now prefers "physical dependence" to "physical addiction" (sort of like how some people prefer "African-American" to "black") but my point still stands.
Rob
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| Posted: Sun, 22nd May 2005 22:52 Post subject: |
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| Cheez-It wrote: | | uhm. all drugs which can cause addiction do not make a person "unnaturally happy"... |
Unnaturally is very very very losely definded. So in his defination the drugs might make ppl "unnaturally" happy.
Eg. you might say there are alot of unnaturally deaths each year. But isnt it totally naturally that ppl die then they are shot through the head or something?
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Cheez-It
Posts: 1106
Location: Rochester, NY
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| Posted: Sun, 22nd May 2005 23:25 Post subject: |
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Whoever wrote that is retarded. the term physical addiction is not defunct. calling it a "psychological addiction" is complete bullshit because it is based *SOLELEY* on biology, and calling it psych addiction just makes people think it's bullshit, which it most certainly is not.
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| Posted: Sun, 22nd May 2005 23:47 Post subject: |
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There was a test a while ago by some Dutch University that gaming gives the human brain the same effect as people that gamble in casinos and poker and stuff.. so those things are addictive so why couldnt gaming be?
Heres the text: (i run it through a translator so the word could be a little weird!!)
Yet pull particular groups now at the bell, because the lust of computer games serious forms on would take. The story is will roll as a result of Jaysen Perkins, a boy, that on average six hour per day spends at Socom, and on this moment is treated for lusts phenomena. Reason for this was according to its mother that its school results under its behavior went suffer and that he self in a social isolation stopped. Although this all sounds as the same problems that we in our youth had (every younger person seeks after all something leukers then school) has the new generation games a dangerous effect on younger persons, according to scientists.
As will the playing of God' and the centrally stand in a game as central figure' younger persons a feeling of power give that they in the real world would not can get, with which the gamewereld more attractive becomes. Yet falls the probably all well with. Everybody has so its hobby, and the number of men that really a bizarre number of hours per day behind the computer spends falls in reality well with. Typically again a fallen freetimepsychologie!
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