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-=Cartoon=-
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 Posted: Sun, 24th Feb 2008 08:45 Post subject: Peter Molyneux joins in with the other idiots |
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http://www.eurogamer.net/article.php?article_id=93121
| Quote: | Eurogamer: What's your take on PC gaming at the moment? Cliff Bleszinski was recently quoted as saying it's in "disarray", so Epic is concentrating on console development for now. Is that an opinion you share?
Peter Molyneux: I think it's a huge tragedy. I mean, you might as well say PC gaming is World of Warcraft and The Sims... The weird thing is everyone's got a PC, they're just not buying software for it.
You only have to look at some of the titles which have recently come out. Crysis - I don't know the final sales figures, but they certainly weren't stellar compared to the amount of effort they put in.
So I think it's a real tragedy. I love the PC. There isn't a tangible reason why it shouldn't still be a great gaming platform. I still think the mouse is a fantastic device for playing games on. We all hail the Wii as being a great innovator but actually, it's a mouse you hold [differently].
Eurogamer: You don't think it's just a perception thing? Digital distribution figures are very difficult to track. Steam says they've got over 13 million accounts; PopCap and companies like that are doing extremely well. Isn't it just that PC gaming is about different things now?
Peter Molyneux: I think that's a fair thing to say. For years, the PC was home to a massive amount of innovation. If you look at the number of genres that came from the PC, they still don't exist anywhere else. RTS games only exist there. That's what's fallen off.
Underneath that, you're quite right. There's an enormous amount of gaming happening with PopCap, Big Fish and Reflective. But here's the fascinating thing - have you been on those sites recently? Forget Steam. Start looking at those sites.
The fascinating thing is when they first started, all these games came out like Peggle and Mystery Files and Alice Greensleeves and Diner Dash, and it felt quite exciting. There was a lot of innovation going on. Okay, there weren't great graphics, but there was innovation.
In my view, that has completely stopped. They're doing the same game over and over again with a different wrapper. It's like a mini-universe in itself which is emulating what's happening in our industry.
The second thing is, you've got The Sims and World of Warcraft sucking all the air out of the PC market. It's just incredible. |
Jealous much peter ?? :S
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chiv
Posts: 27530
Location: Behind You...
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| Posted: Sun, 24th Feb 2008 09:28 Post subject: |
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latest high end nvidia graphics card for $150... high end cpu $300... watch pc gaming come roaring back into style...
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| Posted: Sun, 24th Feb 2008 10:27 Post subject: |
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I don't see why he's an idiot for those comments, I pretty much agree with him, we're not seeing innovation on PC.
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| Posted: Sun, 24th Feb 2008 11:04 Post subject: |
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Molyneux is right on the money. The Sims and WoW showed publishers that in order to hit max sales figures they must:
1. Target the mainstream.
2. Simplify (or dumbdown) to cater to the mainstream.
3. Chop up ideas that were originally for the main launch into countless, thoughtless expansions.
While at its core there's nothing wrong with that (except for 3), the problem is that this huge base of "gamers" (and I use the term very loosely) becomes what publishers aim for - and nothing else.
In minimizing their risk, they simply stick with the same old shit. ABSOLUTELY NO INNOVATION. After all, they don't need it, they already know what the mainstream likes. Why take a chance on something different.
PC gaming would have taken a whole different turn (one infinitely better), had those two titles never been released. That's just the bottom line. Innovation and risk-taking is absolutely key to keeping gaming fresh and moving forward, something the mainstream "gamers" simply don't have room for.
I can never be free, because the shackles I wear can't be touched or be seen.
i9-9900k, MSI MPG-Z390 Gaming Pro Carbon, 32GB DDR4 @ 3000, eVGA GTX 1080 DT, Samsung 970 EVO Plus nVME 1TB
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| Posted: Sun, 24th Feb 2008 11:09 Post subject: |
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i totally agree with Molyneux... So i don't know thy the topic author must bold random quotes... and leave other real-important ones...
Per aspera ad astra
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-=Cartoon=-
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| Posted: Sun, 24th Feb 2008 11:42 Post subject: |
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Because hes bitching and not bringing anything to the table......
You can NOT blame wow or sims... the sims bring a shitload of people into the entire gaming scene that would never be pc gamers in any way.. wow also brings alot of non gaming types to the table aswell....
I dont understand why the hell everyone is all doom and gloom .....
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zmed
Posts: 9234
Location: Orbanistan
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| Posted: Sun, 24th Feb 2008 11:43 Post subject: |
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| RainyDay wrote: | | i totally agree with Molyneux... So i don't know thy the topic author must bold random quotes... and leave other real-important ones... |
Because if he did then he wouldn't be able to attract enough attention to himself.
Peter hit the bullseye with that comment. The only real best-selling titles on the PC at the moment are WoW and the Sims series. No other game gets remotely near those two so "you might as well say PC gaming is World of Warcraft and The Sims". Innovation right now mostly exist exclusively in the Indie market, which isn't big enough to make a difference.
But it's still enough that this game designer genius still beleives in the PC and didn't say it's dead like the others. I love his games ever since PowerMonger (that's right...most of the kiddies never even heard about that game) and never really understood why some people hate him so much. I mean he's like a big kid getting excited talking about games. He obvioulsy love what he's doing. This thing is somehow missing from most other designers these days.
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Ispep
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| Posted: Sun, 24th Feb 2008 12:14 Post subject: |
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If gaming on the PC is World of Warcraft and the Sims then we have a lot to be happy about. It means the platform that's stereotypically associated with 14 year old geeks with $60,000 gaming rigs' is in fact able to cater to and be in demand from the mainstream. That leaves a huge demographic of gamers on the PC to market towards and with digital distribution over networks like Steam and the indie scene growing in stature that can hardly be called BAD NEWS.
Both WoW and the Sims are great game franchises. It's fine if you don't enjoy them, I personally don't enjoy WoW (after playing the trial) for example but like playing with the dolls house that is the Sims, but either way you cannot deny the artistry and the sheer quality of these titles in doing what they are designed to do.
That's the first thing and it's interesting to bring these two up because there was an interview with Will Wright about the Sims recently on RPS (http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/ - PC Gaming blog) where he says he doesn't understand why there isn't a raft of clones. So it's interesting that this hugely successful title which is supposedly sucking all the air out of the PC market isn't being imitated, whereas with WoW there is seemingly a clone each week which fails to make even the slightest dent.
He also mentions, as everyone does (!) Crysis without mentioning (as noone bringing it up does) the alarmingly high hardware requirements, the averageness of the gameplay and the fact that other games like COD4, Bioshock and the Orange Box (all FPS games) trounced it in sales. Nobody is going to be looking back on Crysis with teary eyes, it will be remembered purely for its technological achievement at the expense of gameplay. But for some reason all PC Gamers are at fault for not setting those criticisms aside and rushing out to the shops to buy the game regardless. What heartless swines we are!
Nobody declaring the death of PC Gaming has the balls to stand up and tell me what's so great about console games either. What games on the console are we supposed to be standing up and taking notice of. what's making headway in innovation or going to be remembered five, ten, fifteen years from now. What is it that's so great about the XBOX and the PS3?
...you'll note that you're not allowed to mention any titles ported to/from the PC - and would do well to understand exclusivity deals which are put in place for purely monetary reasons.
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| Posted: Sun, 24th Feb 2008 12:15 Post subject: |
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Wow, it seems the poster is the real idiot...
Peter has always made great games and he's got another one coming.
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| Posted: Sun, 24th Feb 2008 12:48 Post subject: |
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half these people are out of touch with reality anyway piracy is so rampant on the pc! im a big developer and i cant make a fucking profit! its hardly worth our fucking time making a pc game!!!!!
lol then someone like ironclad release a game with no copyprotection , it sells over 200,000 copys in the first few days and its now the number one selling pc game in america, and its not even the type of game alot of people are really intrested in......
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-=Cartoon=-
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| Posted: Sun, 24th Feb 2008 13:12 Post subject: |
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-=Cartoon=-
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| Posted: Sun, 24th Feb 2008 13:15 Post subject: |
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| Ispep wrote: | If gaming on the PC is World of Warcraft and the Sims then we have a lot to be happy about. It means the platform that's stereotypically associated with 14 year old geeks with $60,000 gaming rigs' is in fact able to cater to and be in demand from the mainstream. That leaves a huge demographic of gamers on the PC to market towards and with digital distribution over networks like Steam and the indie scene growing in stature that can hardly be called BAD NEWS.
Both WoW and the Sims are great game franchises. It's fine if you don't enjoy them, I personally don't enjoy WoW (after playing the trial) for example but like playing with the dolls house that is the Sims, but either way you cannot deny the artistry and the sheer quality of these titles in doing what they are designed to do.
That's the first thing and it's interesting to bring these two up because there was an interview with Will Wright about the Sims recently on RPS (http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/ - PC Gaming blog) where he says he doesn't understand why there isn't a raft of clones. So it's interesting that this hugely successful title which is supposedly sucking all the air out of the PC market isn't being imitated, whereas with WoW there is seemingly a clone each week which fails to make even the slightest dent.
He also mentions, as everyone does (!) Crysis without mentioning (as noone bringing it up does) the alarmingly high hardware requirements, the averageness of the gameplay and the fact that other games like COD4, Bioshock and the Orange Box (all FPS games) trounced it in sales. Nobody is going to be looking back on Crysis with teary eyes, it will be remembered purely for its technological achievement at the expense of gameplay. But for some reason all PC Gamers are at fault for not setting those criticisms aside and rushing out to the shops to buy the game regardless. What heartless swines we are!
Nobody declaring the death of PC Gaming has the balls to stand up and tell me what's so great about console games either. What games on the console are we supposed to be standing up and taking notice of. what's making headway in innovation or going to be remembered five, ten, fifteen years from now. What is it that's so great about the XBOX and the PS3?
...you'll note that you're not allowed to mention any titles ported to/from the PC - and would do well to understand exclusivity deals which are put in place for purely monetary reasons. |
Agree 100%
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Epsilon
Dr. Strangelove
Posts: 9240
Location: War Room
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| Posted: Sun, 24th Feb 2008 13:15 Post subject: |
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| snop1050 wrote: | half these people are out of touch with reality anyway piracy is so rampant on the pc! im a big developer and i cant make a fucking profit! its hardly worth our fucking time making a pc game!!!!!
lol then someone like ironclad release a game with no copyprotection , it sells over 200,000 copys in the first few days and its now the number one selling pc game in america, and its not even the type of game alot of people are really intrested in...... |
And so what have you learned?.
Don't aim for the lowest common denominator, the pc crowd that have had pc's since they only used them to play Doom aren't interested in mainstream games anymore. |
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| Posted: Sun, 24th Feb 2008 13:40 Post subject: |
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| Ispep wrote: | If gaming on the PC is World of Warcraft and the Sims then we have a lot to be happy about. It means the platform that's stereotypically associated with 14 year old geeks with $60,000 gaming rigs' is in fact able to cater to and be in demand from the mainstream. That leaves a huge demographic of gamers on the PC to market towards and with digital distribution over networks like Steam and the indie scene growing in stature that can hardly be called BAD NEWS.
Both WoW and the Sims are great game franchises. It's fine if you don't enjoy them, I personally don't enjoy WoW (after playing the trial) for example but like playing with the dolls house that is the Sims, but either way you cannot deny the artistry and the sheer quality of these titles in doing what they are designed to do.
That's the first thing and it's interesting to bring these two up because there was an interview with Will Wright about the Sims recently on RPS (http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/ - PC Gaming blog) where he says he doesn't understand why there isn't a raft of clones. So it's interesting that this hugely successful title which is supposedly sucking all the air out of the PC market isn't being imitated, whereas with WoW there is seemingly a clone each week which fails to make even the slightest dent.
He also mentions, as everyone does (!) Crysis without mentioning (as noone bringing it up does) the alarmingly high hardware requirements, the averageness of the gameplay and the fact that other games like COD4, Bioshock and the Orange Box (all FPS games) trounced it in sales. Nobody is going to be looking back on Crysis with teary eyes, it will be remembered purely for its technological achievement at the expense of gameplay. But for some reason all PC Gamers are at fault for not setting those criticisms aside and rushing out to the shops to buy the game regardless. What heartless swines we are!
Nobody declaring the death of PC Gaming has the balls to stand up and tell me what's so great about console games either. What games on the console are we supposed to be standing up and taking notice of. what's making headway in innovation or going to be remembered five, ten, fifteen years from now. What is it that's so great about the XBOX and the PS3?
...you'll note that you're not allowed to mention any titles ported to/from the PC - and would do well to understand exclusivity deals which are put in place for purely monetary reasons. |
post of the year
also about pc gaming, the 2 games i've played in the past few months are audiosurf and aquaria and yes I bought both. If designers are willing to release something innovative/fresh I will quite happily purchase their product. I don't fucking want a game with stunning graphics and shit gameplay like Crysis or UT, fuck that.
cockcockcockcockcockcockcockcockcockcockcockcock
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| Posted: Sun, 24th Feb 2008 14:40 Post subject: |
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| Fabs wrote: |
Peter has always made great games and he's got another one coming. |
Great games? It's been many years since he last made a great game, back when he was still by Bullfrog
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| Posted: Sun, 24th Feb 2008 14:50 Post subject: |
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| snop1050 wrote: | half these people are out of touch with reality anyway piracy is so rampant on the pc! im a big developer and i cant make a fucking profit! its hardly worth our fucking time making a pc game!!!!!
lol then someone like ironclad release a game with no copyprotection , it sells over 200,000 copys in the first few days and its now the number one selling pc game in america, and its not even the type of game alot of people are really intrested in...... |
Don't be so quick to blame piracy for your lack of sales. There are 2 main types of pirates IMO. The ones who pirate a game to try it before they buy it, and those who do it because they don't want to pay for a product to enjoy it. Group A will buy the game if they find it satisfactory, by which I mean it's a fun game, has relatively few bugs/crashes, has relatively good support, and runs well on the promised specs. Not so unreasonable demands, are they?
Then, there is Group B, who will steal your product without any kind of regret, but these people most likely would not pay for your product if they couldn't pirate it. Deal with it. If someone's too cheap to buy a game even after they see how great it is, what makes you thing they'd buy it without trying it first.
You mentioned IronClad, and SoSE. It's a great example of a well executed game, and shows, that if you create a quality product, you will have enough sales to make profit. As Epsilon pointed out before, it's not necessarily the mainstream, dumbed down games that have the highest sales, as people are looking for something new OR nostalgic, rather than the same old shit that keeps coming out nowdays. No secret formula here, just make a game, that's fun to play, has some replay value (be that multiplayer, versatile single player/multiple stories and endings, or constantly added content), runs well on an average pc, and people will buy it. But if you make a buggy piece of shit, that runs badly on even the best hardware out there, gets boring after 1-2 hours of gameplay, has a storyline that feels like someone threw it together in 20 minutes, has no replay value whatsoever or takes 5 hours to finish, just don't expect people to buy it. If you don't put enough effort into making a game to meet the criteria above, why should people put their hard-earnes cash in it? The gaming industry is as much of a business as any other industry out there, and the same rules apply. To stay alive you need to be fresh, and maintain quality over the years. That's all there's to it. See Bioware (before the EA purchase that is...).
And one last comment. Devs are so fekkin quick to blame everything on piracy, but they tend to overlook one of the main things that cause people to pirate games (IMO). And these things are the false promises, misleading screenshots, videos and demos. That's right. I'm speaking for myself here, but I've reached the point where I completely lost my faith in most developers. I just can't trust their words any more. Whenever we hear the announcement of an upcoming game you devs and publishers always promise that (as Yahtzee said in one of his reviews) your game will descend from the heavens and lead us to the promised land. Most of the time, these games turn out to be above average at best, with a few exceptions, that turn out to be either raw terrible, or become the gems of PC gaming. With this trend becoming even more common, and the increasing price of games, you can't really blame people for not running to the store and buy every new game blindly, can you? You, and your false promises made piracy a necessity nowdays, and don't you ever forget that! So instead of blaming your inability to create a half-decent game on it, you all should join companies like IronClad in making games that are worth to buy, and help bring PC gaming back to it's former glory, back to a state, where it's not poisoned by legions of worthless clones, sequels and boring, uninnovatieve titles. |
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| Posted: Sun, 24th Feb 2008 14:59 Post subject: |
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same here , bought Aquaria also ,
I just don't get why they bitch so much about PC gaming Piracy and blaming the sales figures on them ... they should first look what bullshit product they release or how does it work (releasing a game with impossible to match sys. req. )or how many hours you need to complete it (show me one person that would buy a PC or a Console title when they would hear you can finish it in 3-6h , they would better rent it)....
the most sickening about it is they take the sales figures not from shops but from xbox live accounts , every one knows they statistics are BS , they don't show who bought the game or who rented it or plays a backup copy
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| Posted: Sun, 24th Feb 2008 17:01 Post subject: |
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Welcome Peter! You've just named your competition, now go beat them. Can't? Then what are you doing here!
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| Posted: Sun, 24th Feb 2008 18:50 Post subject: |
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I've got an idea; why not start actually making good games?
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cacaro
Banned
Posts: 253
Location: Somewhere in Italy
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| Posted: Sun, 24th Feb 2008 19:13 Post subject: |
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| Raap wrote: | | I've got an idea; why not start actually making good games? |
Why? Just hype to death some dumbed down RPG(-ish) crap (Fable) like if it was the best RPG ever made and you're done.
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| Posted: Sun, 24th Feb 2008 19:18 Post subject: |
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lol, sounds like he is just bitter because B&W2 was such a flop (no sandbox mode at launch? common...)
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| Posted: Sun, 24th Feb 2008 19:27 Post subject: |
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i agree with Ispep and DrHobo.. most games released recently arent even worth being downloaded for free! seriously.. i want the times back with innovative titles and pure gameplay wonders, in the old days the games were much more special (not speaking nostalgic)
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| Posted: Sun, 24th Feb 2008 22:54 Post subject: |
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| clragon wrote: | | lol, sounds like he is just bitter because B&W2 was such a flop (no sandbox mode at launch? common...) |
b&w2 was such shit, ai always attacked in the exact same way , as they were coming along the map it was like they were on rails, no matter how many times i wiped them out they would aways do the exact same thing over and over again
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| Posted: Mon, 25th Feb 2008 07:27 Post subject: |
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My opinion is that piracy turns the tables. With all the marketing, advertisments and payed glorification of game magazines of new computer games everybody gets the feeling this new game will be pure awesomeness. Now with piracy we get an unbiased look on the complete game and most of the time it turns out the game was just mediocre.
Now I got a suggestion: Don't spend all those millions of dollars on marketing and put that money to some use, i.e. making the game better, improving performance, ridding out bugs. Great games don't need advertisements everywhere as we can see from some indie games.
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Weedo
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cacaro
Banned
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Location: Somewhere in Italy
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| Posted: Mon, 25th Feb 2008 10:30 Post subject: |
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| Weedo wrote: | | all Molyneux games are fantastic |
Not Fable. Basically, all the latest Molyneux games have been hyped to death like if they were supreme masterpieces and they simply disappointed.
Molyneux's games were fantastic when he was still working at Bullfrog.
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| Posted: Mon, 25th Feb 2008 11:22 Post subject: |
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| cacaro wrote: | | Weedo wrote: | | all Molyneux games are fantastic |
Not Fable. Basically, all the latest Molyneux games have been hyped to death like if they were supreme masterpieces and they simply disappointed.
Molyneux's games were fantastic when he was still working at Bullfrog. |
yeah I agree, like other big names he's living off his reputation these days and putting out titles that just fall short..
At least he looks for innovation in his titles tho.
I don't disagree with his statement. The fact is there are a lot of people who own a PC who wouldn't touch crysis with a bargepole yet see WoW as friendly and accessible. It's like comparing Wii and 360. Plus they know the damn thing will work even with integrated graphics. I'd like to know what % of PC owners actually have a half-decent graphics card in their machine. At least when I bought a PC ten years ago it could play the latest games, but now it's most likely to feature shitty integrated graphics. The average user may not bother upgrading their gc and psu and will just buy a console instead if they want to game. Blame the PC manufacturers imo.
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Big_Gun
Posts: 3017
Location: My mother's womb originally. . .
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| Posted: Mon, 25th Feb 2008 13:29 Post subject: I agree. |
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I think PM has a lot of innovative ideas... but I was pretty dissappointed with Black and White 1 and 2. I LOVE Populous, Warmonger, and Dungeon Keeper along with Syndicate.
I thought Fable was ok but certainly didn't turn out to be anything like he was promising in the beginning.
Black and White 2 had great graphics... but it also had shit AI and something about it just didn't click with me. I never even finished that game.
But, I do believe that the cost of PC upgrades is helping to kill PC gaming. And they are coming out with the stuff to quickly as well. Which all game makers then want to use so that they can say their game uses the latest technology which leaves 90% of people out because their machines won't play it.
1 stripe purple belt in JiuJitsu (good grief this takes FOREVER hahah)
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Ankh
Posts: 23238
Location: Trelleborg
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| Posted: Mon, 25th Feb 2008 14:01 Post subject: |
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Speaking of Populous - wouldnt mind a new version of the first 2. No need to change anything but the graphics.
shitloads of new stuff in my pc. Cant keep track of it all.
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