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Werelds
Special Little Man
Posts: 15098
Location: 0100111001001100
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 Posted: Mon, 13th Aug 2012 19:46 Post subject: Alright, which one of you bastards |
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| Posted: Mon, 13th Aug 2012 20:31 Post subject: |
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Probably the economy crisis, people don't buy cars anymore so the prices go up.
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| Posted: Mon, 13th Aug 2012 20:38 Post subject: |
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| madmax17 wrote: | | Probably the economy crisis, people don't buy cars anymore so the prices go up. |
should the price go down instead then?
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BonerUK
Posts: 2496
Location: Liverpool UK
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| Posted: Mon, 13th Aug 2012 20:55 Post subject: |
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| LuftBrada wrote: | | madmax17 wrote: | | Probably the economy crisis, people don't buy cars anymore so the prices go up. |
should the price go down instead then? |
If they have a large quantity in a warehouse that they want to sell right away then yes, otherwise cars are expensive to build. |
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| Posted: Mon, 13th Aug 2012 22:20 Post subject: |
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For that kinda money you can get a 2007 C320 merc. Will piss on all of those cars you've mentioned.
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Werelds
Special Little Man
Posts: 15098
Location: 0100111001001100
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| Posted: Mon, 13th Aug 2012 23:10 Post subject: |
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| Mister_s wrote: | | For that kinda money you can get a 2007 C320 merc. Will piss on all of those cars you've mentioned. |
Not really, not with just 30k on the clock. Plus, fuck Mercedes.
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| Posted: Mon, 13th Aug 2012 23:32 Post subject: |
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I'd take a 250k merc over 10k on one of those cars any day.
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Invasor
Moderator
Posts: 7638
Location: On the road
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| Posted: Tue, 14th Aug 2012 02:01 Post subject: |
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Why not a civic? Maybe even a type-R?
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MAD_MAX333
Moderator
Posts: 7020
Location: Toronto, Canada...eh
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| Posted: Tue, 14th Aug 2012 02:20 Post subject: |
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i dont understand Type Rs.... its still an economy car... with will 200HP give u besides very slight performance gains and loss of some fuel economy and increase in ur insurance? especially in a car that was designed for budget friendly people!
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Invasor
Moderator
Posts: 7638
Location: On the road
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| Posted: Tue, 14th Aug 2012 02:32 Post subject: |
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Well that's in north america where you have plenty of big engines and cheap gas... For other places it makes perfect sense, a practical reliable car with some fuel economy and (still) kinda fun to drive.
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_SiN_
Megatron
Posts: 12108
Location: Cybertron
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| Posted: Tue, 14th Aug 2012 08:19 Post subject: |
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| MAD_MAX333 wrote: | | i dont understand Type Rs.... its still an economy car... with will 200HP give u besides very slight performance gains and loss of some fuel economy and increase in ur insurance? especially in a car that was designed for budget friendly people! |
I wouldn't say that the Type-R's were made for "budget friendly"-people, in the sense that the standard Civic is. The Type-R is just a lightweight, reliable, and very fun to drive car, and even though it has 205 hp (if we're talking about the EP3 Civic), it's still very cheap to own and drive.
One of my previous cars was an Integra Type-R (DC2) with the engine of the EP3 Civic (the K20A) swapped in to it. Some of the aftermarket parts on it was a programable ECU, cams, full exhaust (with 4-2-1 header), intake and so on - it made just over 250 hp. But it was probably one of the most fun cars I've ever driven, and I've driven cars with three times the power. Point is, Type-R-models are most of the time very fun to drive, while retaining drivability, reliability and economy.
Watercooled 5950X | AORUS Master X570 | Asus RTX 3090 TUF Gaming OC | 64Gb RAM | 1Tb 970 Evo Plus + 2Tb 660p | etc etc
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| Posted: Tue, 14th Aug 2012 08:28 Post subject: |
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Just get any old rustbucket and put your money into a motorcycle.
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| Posted: Tue, 14th Aug 2012 09:00 Post subject: |
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| Invasor wrote: | | Well that's in north america where you have plenty of big engines and cheap gas... For other places it makes perfect sense, a practical reliable car with some fuel economy and (still) kinda fun to drive. |
There are a number of cars in the same price range as the Civic Type R / Si which are faster around a track, and a hell of a lot more fun to drive though. (And still have small engine sizes to beat high taxation)
It's not as lightweight as one would like to think. 2800 lbs. So 200HP and 130 ft/lbs of torque isn't going to propel you around a track very fast. (The lack of torque is what kills it) Out of the box it doesn't have the best handling either.
Meanwhile for the same price as the fastest Civic you can get a MPS 3 in the UK/Europe markets. Out of the box is currently the best handling FWD car available besides the Focus RS (Which is a hell of alot more expensive), and gets around the corners faster then even the AWD WRX. Has a hell of a lot more power so it's not going to be left behind at the straights like the Civic, and being a stock turbo car means it's easy to get even more power out of it.
Honda in the worldwide market right now is complete shit. Given for the same price range as the Civic Si / Type R you can get the MPS3, WRX, Focus ST, etc..
I really question why anyone would buy it given options which are clearly better in every metric. Including interior quality. Of course, I really don't question it. People buy it because they beleive Honda to still be a decent company. They are buying it based on brand name alone.
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spankie
VIP Member
Posts: 2958
Location: Belgium
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| Posted: Tue, 14th Aug 2012 10:08 Post subject: |
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| madmax17 wrote: | | LuftBrada wrote: | | madmax17 wrote: | | Probably the economy crisis, people don't buy cars anymore so the prices go up. |
should the price go down instead then? |
If they have a large quantity in a warehouse that they want to sell right away then yes, otherwise cars are expensive to build. |
some rocket science economics going on here...
There's only one reason why prices are up nowadays.
Cars are safer, more efficient, heavily taxed, more regulated in the building process, more high tech. Companies cant push high prices with low demands, demand dictates the economy, not supply.
I went to buy a new car yesterday and they gave me all kinds of discounts just to convince me to buy a new car. Crisis sure is beneficial if you want to buy a new car, you can get good prices. All the sellers are doing incredible tricks to build revenue.
Got a nice small VW for 11k. Not a racing mobile, but nice small 5 doors with airco, sat nav, etc. Not the coolest car, but it certainly does the job
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| Posted: Tue, 14th Aug 2012 10:42 Post subject: |
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| spankie wrote: | | madmax17 wrote: | | LuftBrada wrote: |
should the price go down instead then? |
If they have a large quantity in a warehouse that they want to sell right away then yes, otherwise cars are expensive to build. |
some rocket science economics going on here...
There's only one reason why prices are up nowadays.
Cars are safer, more efficient, heavily taxed, more regulated in the building process, more high tech. Companies cant push high prices with low demands, demand dictates the economy, not supply.
I went to buy a new car yesterday and they gave me all kinds of discounts just to convince me to buy a new car. Crisis sure is beneficial if you want to buy a new car, you can get good prices. All the sellers are doing incredible tricks to build revenue.
Got a nice small VW for 11k. Not a racing mobile, but nice small 5 doors with airco, sat nav, etc. Not the coolest car, but it certainly does the job |
But the cars on average are at least $10-15k more expensive then the states. Most of which is due to VAT and/or other bullshit taxes.
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Werelds
Special Little Man
Posts: 15098
Location: 0100111001001100
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| Posted: Tue, 14th Aug 2012 10:57 Post subject: |
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| Mister_s wrote: | | I'd take a 250k merc over 10k on one of those cars any day. |
You're underestimating something like the Colt Ralliart (the "regular" 150 BHP edition), or any of the other small hot hatches for that matter. You say a C320 "shits all over it" - how exactly? Because the Colt is not a fucking elephant that little 150 BHP engine still gets it to 100 faster than a C320. It's also cheaper to drive on every front: cheaper insurance, less road taxes and far better fuel consumption (despite the turbo it still does 15km/l unlike the barely 10/l a C320 does). And mind you, that little thing comes on 16" wheels just like a C320 does. Not to mention that parts for a Merc, like any other "upper tier" brand, are more expensive (should anything break). Sorry, but no, I fail to see how a C320 (or any Merc anywhere near affordable) would shit all over a hot hatch.
That is aside from the looks; like I said, I don't like Mercedes at all. They look like complete shit as far as I'm concerned. There's tons of better looking and better performing cars in lower price regions.
| Invasor wrote: | | Why not a civic? Maybe even a type-R? |
| MAD_MAX333 wrote: | | i dont understand Type Rs.... its still an economy car... with will 200HP give u besides very slight performance gains and loss of some fuel economy and increase in ur insurance? especially in a car that was designed for budget friendly people! |
Like Mchart says, cars are a lot more expensive here, plus fuel consumption matters much more because petrol is ridiculously expensive here. We pay between $8.00 and $8.20 per gallon right now, well over twice as much as in the U.S.
So hot hatches are actually pretty awesome since fuel consumption is often still pretty good, yet a lot of these things are actually very fucking quick (Colt Ralliart gets to 60 MPH in less than 7.5 seconds, a Mazda 3 MPS does it in just over 6 seconds). Plus, the good ones handle really well apart from being quick.
Been looking around a bit more and it seems I'm gonna have to up my budget a bit or go for a larger car :<
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_SiN_
Megatron
Posts: 12108
Location: Cybertron
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Werelds
Special Little Man
Posts: 15098
Location: 0100111001001100
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_SiN_
Megatron
Posts: 12108
Location: Cybertron
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| Posted: Tue, 14th Aug 2012 15:01 Post subject: |
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I just put a BNR S3 in my Speed3 and have just about 380WHP/418WTQ. Tuned using Cobb's accesstuner race obviously. Wish E85 were easier to get around here, because i'd mix a couple gallons of that in my tank to advance ignition even farther. Would put me over 400WHP easily.
I still get 24MPG average, and 30MPG on long distance drives which isn't bad for a car with that much power.
And the latest generation WRX is now considered a 'hot hatch'.
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ixigia
[Moderator] Consigliere
Posts: 65161
Location: Italy
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| Posted: Tue, 14th Aug 2012 15:10 Post subject: |
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I desperately need a new car too but can't afford it at the moment, the Yaris is worth less than 2000€ and even the second-hand car market is out of my league..(was looking for a used Polo, but VW cars are damn expensive here). Not to mention the gas, which is still 1.8+€ per liter 
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Werelds
Special Little Man
Posts: 15098
Location: 0100111001001100
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ixigia
[Moderator] Consigliere
Posts: 65161
Location: Italy
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| Posted: Tue, 14th Aug 2012 15:58 Post subject: |
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| Werelds wrote: | Polos and Golfs are well within my budget but they're so damn boring  |
Haha yeah, but I'm looking for something trusty, reliable and not ugly..and an old golf would be ideal  . There are so many speed limits+cameras here in my zone that anything more powerful than a Fiat Panda will get you a ticket |
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Werelds
Special Little Man
Posts: 15098
Location: 0100111001001100
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ixigia
[Moderator] Consigliere
Posts: 65161
Location: Italy
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| Posted: Tue, 14th Aug 2012 17:08 Post subject: |
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| Werelds wrote: | Wait, what? Since when do you have speed limits, because that's not how I remember Italy, I remember fuckers doing 100 (even in town) and it being normal
From Brennerpass onto the Autostrada towards the south (A22 then A1 I think?) was even better, us doing 140 and every fucking Italian still passing us |
Yeah, stricter rules have been implemented lately and the police are definitely giving out more tickets than before (thanks to a massive deployment of speed cameras) ...in this crisis the state needs more money xD. That said, crazy people are still there |
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| Posted: Tue, 14th Aug 2012 22:00 Post subject: |
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My father is driving a 1.4 TSI 180hp Polo GTI, does 8/100 outside city, and 10+ inside..
WTF, the 1.4L is supposed to be economical.. even with it's DSG transmission
And I'm driving a 1.9 TDI Polo 9N3, does 6/100 inside and 5/100 outside. Pretty good milage.
For 70eur I go around 1000km.
And almost all VW cars retain a lot of their price over the years.
| Lutzifer wrote: | | and yes, mine is only average |
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