|
|
| Page 1 of 2 |
|
|
|
| Back to top |
|
 |
Epsilon
Dr. Strangelove
Posts: 9240
Location: War Room
|
 Posted: Wed, 17th Feb 2010 03:11 Post subject: |
|
|
|
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
|
| Posted: Wed, 17th Feb 2010 09:41 Post subject: |
|
|
cool one 
"Quantum mechanics is actually, contrary to it's reputation, unbeliveably simple, once you take the physics out."
Scott Aaronson | chiv wrote: | | thats true you know. newton didnt discover gravity. the apple told him about it, and then he killed it. the core was never found. |
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
|
| Posted: Wed, 17th Feb 2010 10:19 Post subject: |
|
|
| madnessnaab wrote: | I always thought I'm a tall guy, but now I feel so small  |
But comparing to strings you are very, very tall 
"Quantum mechanics is actually, contrary to it's reputation, unbeliveably simple, once you take the physics out."
Scott Aaronson | chiv wrote: | | thats true you know. newton didnt discover gravity. the apple told him about it, and then he killed it. the core was never found. |
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
ixigia
[Moderator] Consigliere
Posts: 65078
Location: Italy
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
kalato
Posts: 1492
Location: Finland and UK
|
| Posted: Wed, 17th Feb 2010 13:10 Post subject: |
|
|
There has to be life out there, space is so friggin huge.
I like bum.
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
|
| Posted: Wed, 17th Feb 2010 16:41 Post subject: |
|
|
Last edited by Yondaime on Mon, 2nd Dec 2024 15:53; edited 1 time in total
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
|
| Posted: Wed, 17th Feb 2010 17:59 Post subject: |
|
|
| kalato wrote: | | There has to be life out there, space is so friggin huge. |
I don't think anyone besides religous nutjobs think that we are alone in the universe.
The real problem stems from the same issue - Space is fucking huge. We are not alone. However, because of the extreme distances involved - We will probably never encounter other self-aware life forms.
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
|
| Posted: Wed, 17th Feb 2010 18:25 Post subject: |
|
|
| Mchart wrote: | | kalato wrote: | | There has to be life out there, space is so friggin huge. |
I don't think anyone besides religous nutjobs think that we are alone in the universe.
The real problem stems from the same issue - Space is fucking huge. We are not alone. However, because of the extreme distances involved - We will probably never encounter other self-aware life forms. |
Never say never, we have huge amount of time on our hands, and we can't say what we'll discover in 20 yrs, so in 100 or so years a lot can happen...
"Quantum mechanics is actually, contrary to it's reputation, unbeliveably simple, once you take the physics out."
Scott Aaronson | chiv wrote: | | thats true you know. newton didnt discover gravity. the apple told him about it, and then he killed it. the core was never found. |
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
|
| Posted: Wed, 17th Feb 2010 21:40 Post subject: |
|
|
Last edited by Yondaime on Mon, 2nd Dec 2024 15:53; edited 1 time in total
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
|
| Posted: Wed, 17th Feb 2010 22:09 Post subject: |
|
|
| dingo_d wrote: | | Mchart wrote: | | kalato wrote: | | There has to be life out there, space is so friggin huge. |
I don't think anyone besides religous nutjobs think that we are alone in the universe.
The real problem stems from the same issue - Space is fucking huge. We are not alone. However, because of the extreme distances involved - We will probably never encounter other self-aware life forms. |
Never say never, we have huge amount of time on our hands, and we can't say what we'll discover in 20 yrs, so in 100 or so years a lot can happen... |
with the way climate changing every now and then plus gov's with happy nuke triggers i srsly doubt that
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
|
| Posted: Wed, 17th Feb 2010 22:12 Post subject: |
|
|
| Mortibus wrote: | | dingo_d wrote: | | Mchart wrote: |
I don't think anyone besides religous nutjobs think that we are alone in the universe.
The real problem stems from the same issue - Space is fucking huge. We are not alone. However, because of the extreme distances involved - We will probably never encounter other self-aware life forms. |
Never say never, we have huge amount of time on our hands, and we can't say what we'll discover in 20 yrs, so in 100 or so years a lot can happen... |
with the way climate changing every now and then plus gov's with happy nuke triggers i srsly doubt that |
I'm still clinging to the hope that I'll find myself on the last rocket towards Mars
"Quantum mechanics is actually, contrary to it's reputation, unbeliveably simple, once you take the physics out."
Scott Aaronson | chiv wrote: | | thats true you know. newton didnt discover gravity. the apple told him about it, and then he killed it. the core was never found. |
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Parallax_
VIP Member
Posts: 6422
Location: Norway
|
| Posted: Wed, 17th Feb 2010 22:17 Post subject: |
|
|
The scale of the universe, displayed to you in a ridiculously small flash applet.
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Ronhrin
Banned
Posts: 6428
Location: Paradigms are changeable, reality is absolute.
|
| Posted: Wed, 17th Feb 2010 22:20 Post subject: |
|
|
| dingo_d wrote: | | Mortibus wrote: | | dingo_d wrote: |
Never say never, we have huge amount of time on our hands, and we can't say what we'll discover in 20 yrs, so in 100 or so years a lot can happen... |
with the way climate changing every now and then plus gov's with happy nuke triggers i srsly doubt that |
I'm still clinging to the hope that I'll find myself on the last rocket towards Mars |
Our technological evolution is merely making use of nature's laws in a complex design.
We can only evolve so much until we reach the point of maximum advancement.
If for instance, super luminal travel is not possible and wormholes unreal or to unstable to be used, we're really stuck on a fraction of the universe.
He who sacrifices freedom for security deserves neither
- Benjamin Franklin - 1759
 |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
|
| Posted: Wed, 17th Feb 2010 23:32 Post subject: |
|
|
| Ronhrin wrote: | | dingo_d wrote: | | Mortibus wrote: |
with the way climate changing every now and then plus gov's with happy nuke triggers i srsly doubt that |
I'm still clinging to the hope that I'll find myself on the last rocket towards Mars |
Our technological evolution is merely making use of nature's laws in a complex design.
We can only evolve so much until we reach the point of maximum advancement.
If for instance, super luminal travel is not possible and wormholes unreal or to unstable to be used, we're really stuck on a fraction of the universe. |
See I believe that there are no limits to our advancement, I mean I see no reason why there would be.
@ Mortibus: You're just jealous that I'll be on the last rocket to Mars and you'll be here 
"Quantum mechanics is actually, contrary to it's reputation, unbeliveably simple, once you take the physics out."
Scott Aaronson | chiv wrote: | | thats true you know. newton didnt discover gravity. the apple told him about it, and then he killed it. the core was never found. |
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Ronhrin
Banned
Posts: 6428
Location: Paradigms are changeable, reality is absolute.
|
| Posted: Wed, 17th Feb 2010 23:49 Post subject: |
|
|
| dingo_d wrote: | | Ronhrin wrote: | | dingo_d wrote: |
I'm still clinging to the hope that I'll find myself on the last rocket towards Mars |
Our technological evolution is merely making use of nature's laws in a complex design.
We can only evolve so much until we reach the point of maximum advancement.
If for instance, super luminal travel is not possible and wormholes unreal or to unstable to be used, we're really stuck on a fraction of the universe. |
See I believe that there are no limits to our advancement, I mean I see no reason why there would be.
@ Mortibus: You're just jealous that I'll be on the last rocket to Mars and you'll be here |
That has nothing to do with believe on your part, it's rather the remnant of a human emotion of control and power, the illusion of which anything is possible and that it is within our grasp the ability do achieve anything, the perception that we can achieve a godlike status and become in some sense the masters of this physical reality.
As for the plausibility of achieving some similar status, it is both very possible and unlikely in the sense that, it is physically possible to achieve individual immortality, it is very possible to colonize other planets, travel to other systems and in a very remote future even be able to coexist in several galaxies within our galactic super cluster, but as far as the prospect of instantaneous universal travel between remote regions of the universe and the ability to survive the eventual end of the universe, this is a entirely different subject, as this as far as our current knowledge goes, violates the known laws of nature, so either we have our physical understanding of the universe deeply wrong or there are really things we can never achieve.
He who sacrifices freedom for security deserves neither
- Benjamin Franklin - 1759
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
LeoNatan
☢ NFOHump Despot ☢
Posts: 73196
Location: Ramat Gan, Israel 🇮🇱
|
| Posted: Wed, 17th Feb 2010 23:53 Post subject: |
|
|
So no FTL jump drives?
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Ronhrin
Banned
Posts: 6428
Location: Paradigms are changeable, reality is absolute.
|
| Posted: Wed, 17th Feb 2010 23:59 Post subject: |
|
|
| iNatan wrote: | | So no FTL jump drives? |
That is one of those sci-fi concepts that is simple impossible under current scientific knowledge.
The reality would be something more along the lines of humans achieving immortality and take the luminal speed approach, meaning 4 years to alpha centauri, 100.000 years to the other edge of the milky way, 3.000.000 to the Andromeda galaxy, it should be a fun, exciting ride 
He who sacrifices freedom for security deserves neither
- Benjamin Franklin - 1759
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
LeoNatan
☢ NFOHump Despot ☢
Posts: 73196
Location: Ramat Gan, Israel 🇮🇱
|
| Posted: Thu, 18th Feb 2010 00:02 Post subject: |
|
|
Damn you! You shuttered my dream of exploring the Virgo Supercluster! 
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
|
| Posted: Thu, 18th Feb 2010 00:07 Post subject: |
|
|
| Ronhrin wrote: | | dingo_d wrote: | | Ronhrin wrote: |
Our technological evolution is merely making use of nature's laws in a complex design.
We can only evolve so much until we reach the point of maximum advancement.
If for instance, super luminal travel is not possible and wormholes unreal or to unstable to be used, we're really stuck on a fraction of the universe. |
See I believe that there are no limits to our advancement, I mean I see no reason why there would be.
@ Mortibus: You're just jealous that I'll be on the last rocket to Mars and you'll be here |
That has nothing to do with believe on your part, it's rather the remnant of a human emotion of control and power, the illusion of which anything is possible and that it is within our grasp the ability do achieve anything, the perception that we can achieve a godlike status and become in some sense the masters of this physical reality.
As for the plausibility of achieving some similar status, it is both very possible and unlikely in the sense that, it is physically possible to achieve individual immortality, it is very possible to colonize other planets, travel to other systems and in a very remote future even be able to coexist in several galaxies within our galactic super cluster, but as far as the prospect of instantaneous universal travel between remote regions of the universe and the ability to survive the eventual end of the universe, this is a entirely different subject, as this as far as our current knowledge goes, violates the known laws of nature, so either we have our physical understanding of the universe deeply wrong or there are really things we can never achieve. |
Surely the laws of physics must be obeyed, but keep in mind that as we evolved (technologically and personally) so did our understanding of the world around us.
For instance we know today that the universe will die (because of thermodynamics) but we still can't explain consciousness, on any level, so we can't make experiment to see what happens to it. Does it obey the laws of thermodynamics, or quantum physics ? We still don't know. But maybe we will in times to come
@Leo: No, that would violate the causality, not only would than be able to travel through time, you would have the problem with total energy (the functional of the electromagnetic wave which gives the energy of the wave is in fact invariant of the movement of the wave - the c is max velocity with which information can propagate)...
"Quantum mechanics is actually, contrary to it's reputation, unbeliveably simple, once you take the physics out."
Scott Aaronson | chiv wrote: | | thats true you know. newton didnt discover gravity. the apple told him about it, and then he killed it. the core was never found. |
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Ronhrin
Banned
Posts: 6428
Location: Paradigms are changeable, reality is absolute.
|
| Posted: Thu, 18th Feb 2010 00:08 Post subject: |
|
|
| iNatan wrote: | |
- Let's visit grandmother down in Andromeda...
3 million years later
- Hi grandma how's everything, I kind of miss dad back on Earth
3 million years later
- Hi dad, any important news on the last 6 million years?
- Yeah, Dinosaurs got extinct again.
To your Edit post, you can explore the Virgo cluster, if you got like 20 million years available on your schedule, I'm sure you can arrange that
He who sacrifices freedom for security deserves neither
- Benjamin Franklin - 1759
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Ronhrin
Banned
Posts: 6428
Location: Paradigms are changeable, reality is absolute.
|
| Posted: Thu, 18th Feb 2010 00:17 Post subject: |
|
|
| dingo_d wrote: | | Ronhrin wrote: | | dingo_d wrote: |
See I believe that there are no limits to our advancement, I mean I see no reason why there would be.
@ Mortibus: You're just jealous that I'll be on the last rocket to Mars and you'll be here |
That has nothing to do with believe on your part, it's rather the remnant of a human emotion of control and power, the illusion of which anything is possible and that it is within our grasp the ability do achieve anything, the perception that we can achieve a godlike status and become in some sense the masters of this physical reality.
As for the plausibility of achieving some similar status, it is both very possible and unlikely in the sense that, it is physically possible to achieve individual immortality, it is very possible to colonize other planets, travel to other systems and in a very remote future even be able to coexist in several galaxies within our galactic super cluster, but as far as the prospect of instantaneous universal travel between remote regions of the universe and the ability to survive the eventual end of the universe, this is a entirely different subject, as this as far as our current knowledge goes, violates the known laws of nature, so either we have our physical understanding of the universe deeply wrong or there are really things we can never achieve. |
Surely the laws of physics must be obeyed, but keep in mind that as we evolved (technologically and personally) so did our understanding of the world around us.
For instance we know today that the universe will die (because of thermodynamics) but we still can't explain consciousness, on any level, so we can't make experiment to see what happens to it. Does it obey the laws of thermodynamics, or quantum physics ? We still don't know. But maybe we will in times to come
@Leo: No, that would violate the causality, not only would than be able to travel through time, you would have the problem with total energy (the functional of the electromagnetic wave which gives the energy of the wave is in fact invariant of the movement of the wave - the c is max velocity with which information can propagate)... |
And that is what I was arguing, it is indeed possible that our entire understanding of reality is simply wrong because we are unable to identify or experience some major key of evidential knowledge.
But under the assumption that our current laws of physics are indeed correct, then it is simply impossible to achieve some science fiction outcomes.
He who sacrifices freedom for security deserves neither
- Benjamin Franklin - 1759
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
LeoNatan
☢ NFOHump Despot ☢
Posts: 73196
Location: Ramat Gan, Israel 🇮🇱
|
| Posted: Thu, 18th Feb 2010 00:27 Post subject: |
|
|
Well fine, if FTL is not possible, then I'll use worm holes for my multimillion light year travels.
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Ronhrin
Banned
Posts: 6428
Location: Paradigms are changeable, reality is absolute.
|
| Posted: Thu, 18th Feb 2010 00:35 Post subject: |
|
|
| iNatan wrote: | | Well fine, if FTL is not possible, then I'll use worm holes for my multimillion light year travels. |
I have a thesis of my own in which I discuss the possibility than in some sense, physical reality is an infinite continuous of systems "constructed" in top of each other, it is a thesis without mathematical background, it was merely resultant of a brain storming situation, but what I state is that, instead of string theory, what we understand as the construct at the planck lenght it is actually yet another system similar to out atomic system and our gravitational system, and this set of constructs is actually infinite, our macro universe is yet another construct on a far greater layer of the universe.
While brainstorming about this subject, I actually came up with the somewhat plausible view in where if we, in a extremely remote future, in a very evolved state, be able to control every aspect of our universal level would be able to create living systems in a higher branch of reality in order to tap into yet another layer of the universe, and in some sense transport whatever portion of what consciousness is into that higher universal level, and perhaps this process has been happening through a countless number of universal layers until it reached our own, this might be completely without mathematical background, but at least it would be a great subject in a sci fi book
He who sacrifices freedom for security deserves neither
- Benjamin Franklin - 1759
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
|
| Posted: Thu, 18th Feb 2010 00:45 Post subject: |
|
|
Last edited by Yondaime on Mon, 2nd Dec 2024 15:53; edited 1 time in total
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Ronhrin
Banned
Posts: 6428
Location: Paradigms are changeable, reality is absolute.
|
| Posted: Thu, 18th Feb 2010 01:01 Post subject: |
|
|
| Yondaime wrote: | Keep on writing this stuff Ronhrin, I like it! 
And yes, it does sound like a good movie, though I wouldn't expect it to become mainstream if I were you. |
I can't even imagine how such concepts could be placed into a movie, but done right it could be a very good sci fi book, however, I came up with these ideas as merely plausible scientific views, and not some kind of fictional saga, I did realize a little time later that it could actually work as an epic saga, but it sort of remained in standby in the back of my mind, mainly because I haven't got the time to explore it further, neither from a strict scientific standpoint or from a fictional one.
But everytime I think about it, I come to the realization that it is a very powerful idea on those two fronts.
He who sacrifices freedom for security deserves neither
- Benjamin Franklin - 1759
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
|
| Posted: Thu, 18th Feb 2010 01:46 Post subject: |
|
|
|
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
| Page 1 of 2 |
All times are GMT + 1 Hour |
|
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum
|
Powered by phpBB 2.0.8 © 2001, 2002 phpBB Group
|
|
 |
|
