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 Posted: Sat, 16th Apr 2005 22:26 Post subject: |
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| kachain wrote: | Sorry but before you call any of us "blind or worse" then let me ask you something:
first you say:
| Quote: | | srs was nuked because it was uncracked, but the exe was taken from european retail that wasn't protected. |
and just after that:
| Quote: | | whoever comes here to say rld uses unprotected exe must be really blind, or worse |
With all respect, aren't you... "blind or worse" (your words)? |
just look in the street racing syndacate nfo and search where relaoded tells that they cracked the game... you won't find anything, rld released the uk retail version, which is unprotected. the only thing we can say to them is that in the nfo they wrote the game was starforce, while it was starforce in the u.s. and unprotected in europe... where's the problem? they never said in the nfo they cracked it
but we aren't discussing on one game right? there's people here that says rld never cracked a sf3 game, and this is really funny because they do not bring anything to prove that...
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| Posted: Sat, 16th Apr 2005 22:31 Post subject: |
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Just rebuking someone who claimed that RLD have never used an unprotected EXE as a solution to Starforce and all their cracks are full retail, which is absolute nonsense, nothing more.
No-one is saying that RLD have never cracked a Starforce game, merely that they have taken short cuts on occasion with the games that are more strenuously protected in retail versions, including using unprotected EXEs, cracking softer review/beta editions, using softer protected other region EXEs amongst other things.
EDIT: Unfortunately at some point the scene became anal about these things and it's ended up being fine for some to do it, but others using certain techniques to break protections is against the rules.
Frankly who really gives a flying fuck so long as it's stable and does its' job. Apparently some do, so long as it doesn't apply to them. Just the way it is I guess.
Last edited by CableMunkeh on Sat, 16th Apr 2005 22:39; edited 1 time in total
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| Posted: Sat, 16th Apr 2005 22:37 Post subject: |
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| Quote: | | there's people here that says rld never cracked a sf3 game, and this is really funny because they do not bring anything to prove that... |
I know what you mean. I respect the work of sceners. No matter if it's Reloaded, Hoodlum, Immersion or the outside player Ultima. This thread doesn't say that Reloaded didn't crack Starforce 3. For sure they did. The problem people discuss here is kind of Reloaded cracks. The discussin covers the endless topic: was it virtual machine or not, was it real crack or beta and similar questions.
I respect people. No matter if it's some Hoodlum or Reloaded fan, you shouldn't suggest that somebody is "blind or worse".
Let them talk or you will see them posting the same war in PC Games Arena forum.
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SycoShaman
VIP Master Jedi
Posts: 24468
Location: Toronto, Canada
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| Posted: Sat, 16th Apr 2005 23:02 Post subject: |
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its all free right?
why complain?
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| Posted: Sat, 16th Apr 2005 23:15 Post subject: |
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Because there are people who would like to know a little more than game and publisher name.
I was thrown out of college for cheating on the metaphysics exam; I looked into the soul of the boy next to me.
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SycoShaman
VIP Master Jedi
Posts: 24468
Location: Toronto, Canada
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| Posted: Sat, 16th Apr 2005 23:24 Post subject: |
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| kachain wrote: | | Because there are people who would like to know a little more than game and publisher name. |
smart remark....but really? can u crack sf3 (by u i mean ppl bitching in general)? no. are u part of the scene? the part that deals with cracking? no
can u write tools to remove any of the new protections? can u code an loader ("illegal crack")? do u have the reversing knowledge to provide some other type of workaround? if so, please share and i will be most greatful 
but i suspect the answer is no (cept maybe loader, but that doesnt help if u cant crack protection) to every question
so why dog the ppl tryin to do it for you?
Discuss the way in which a game is cracked, by all means
but why say something isnt a true crack based on some technicallity the "scene" created? Dont get me wrong, i understand the difference, but if right now, the only way to bypass SF3 is emu, mini-image, removing drivers etc...i'll take it Im sure that they would like to crack every game perfectly too...but maybe, thats not a logical way to approach things anymore?
i dunno |
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| Posted: Sat, 16th Apr 2005 23:35 Post subject: |
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| Quote: | | *Puts hand up vigorously |
me too
| Quote: | | but why say something isnt a true crack based on some technicallity the "scene" created? |
man, that's exactly what i'm talking about. i really have nothing against Reloaded itself but when i saw their 10 pages NFO with "loaders" story i really got pissed because i knew their nukes caused by fake, betas or unprotected executables.... that's fucking cheating and i don't have any respect for such fakers
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| Posted: Sat, 16th Apr 2005 23:52 Post subject: |
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| lAmBaDa wrote: | | Quote: | | *Puts hand up vigorously |
me too
| Quote: | | but why say something isnt a true crack based on some technicallity the "scene" created? |
man, that's exactly what i'm talking about. i really have nothing against Reloaded itself but when i saw their 10 pages NFO with "loaders" story i really got pissed because i knew their nukes caused by fake, betas or unprotected executables.... that's fucking cheating and i don't have any respect for such fakers |
What he said, no-one would give a shit about these things if it weren't for the fact that groups having gotten a release nuked because it doesn't conform to their idea of how a release should be then do worse themselves.
As I said earlier, if a game works, and is stable, why should it be nuked? Does it really matter that much if it was done through a full reverse, exploitation of a bug in the protection, loader containing the protection in a VE of its' own, who really really cares? It's technically interesting to see, but to nuke a release?
Especially when it's a release of a game still no-one else has touched (XR) because it doesn't conform.
No wonder Ultima didn't release much more, who'd want to be associated with a 'scene' that bitches at you for doing what no-one else could, because you didn't want to do it 'their' way.
For those who didn't know XR wasn't actually released via 'the scene' anyway, it was released on P2P scene took it and nuked it.... Some might ask just wtf it was to do with them if it wasn't released through their channels...
But hey this conversation belongs in 'scene'
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| Posted: Sun, 17th Apr 2005 00:01 Post subject: Re: Second Sight - RLD |
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| bigboy177 wrote: | Can someone please explain to me... Why there are so many crackers, so many ppl who say RLD didn't crack it... they just took exe from this or that... If they are so good, and know so much about protections and cracking, why won't they start cracking games by themselves...
They say that exes are from betas and shit like that... It only shows that they know shit about how SF3 works.... |
Going back to the subject in hand, I'm currently working on all the above, I've an idea how SF3 works although my understanding is, in common with virtually everyone very incomplete and vague.
As has been said, if you don't like what other people are doing go do it yourself, fair words.
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| Posted: Sun, 17th Apr 2005 00:18 Post subject: |
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I think this Topic went a lil bit off track... RLD releases games... most of them are properly cracked... I forgot about SRS that's true... maybe it was a one time occasion (no aother game was nuked...), or maybe nukers got it wrong who cares... They're doing a damn good job, and ppl bitching about betas, reviews and stuff like that are just annoying... If they can do it better, than please DO... Everyone would be glad...
| CableMunkeh wrote: |
No wonder Ultima didn't release much more, who'd want to be associated with a 'scene' that bitches at you for doing what no-one else could, because you didn't want to do it 'their' way. |
Amen...
If I was in RLD I would release shit for such ignorants...
Last edited by bigboy177 on Sun, 17th Apr 2005 00:55; edited 1 time in total
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| Posted: Sun, 17th Apr 2005 00:28 Post subject: |
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| Quote: | | Especially when it's a release of a game still no-one else has touched (XR) because it doesn't conform. |
lol, you talk about my best game. i just love it and maybe that's why i really appreciate ultima's job, but most of all i see it's cracked, not betas or trials or whatever. ultima could set the rules (they set indeed after being respected with Colin 2005 for own installer (not nuked) - probably other group would get nuked) and bring the definitions to the scene but they didn't do that. when i was installing xr i saw: "we respect the following legends" and mentioned many groups. they called Reloaded a legend? for what? the same Reloaded few weeks later writes idiotic 10 pages NFO with "loaders" story. i ask again: who TF they are to learn the scene what loader is and what it isn't? after scene discovered their cheating with cracks they should change the name and start new group
| Quote: | | No wonder Ultima didn't release much more, who'd want to be associated with a 'scene' that bitches at you for doing what no-one else could, because you didn't want to do it 'their' way. |
agree
| Quote: | | XR wasn't actually released via 'the scene' anyway, it was released on P2P scene took it and nuked it.... |
that's right. i remember it very well. that nuke should be called the most stupid nuke of the century, but hey, come on, nforce respected them with Colin so maybe times change? respect for nforce for respecting others style
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| Posted: Sun, 17th Apr 2005 00:45 Post subject: |
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It's in close competition with the PCGame release of Star Wars KOTR for stupidest nuke, that was nuked because VNG couldn't understand the (perfectly working) crack so called it bad.
Incredibly PCGame have disappeared as well...
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TheDuck
Posts: 148
Location: Australia
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| Posted: Sun, 17th Apr 2005 02:12 Post subject: |
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| lAmBaDa wrote: | | Quote: | | Especially when it's a release of a game still no-one else has touched (XR) because it doesn't conform. |
lol, you talk about my best game. i just love it and maybe that's why i really appreciate ultima's job, but most of all i see it's cracked, not betas or trials or whatever. ultima could set the rules (they set indeed after being respected with Colin 2005 for own installer (not nuked) - probably other group would get nuked) and bring the definitions to the scene but they didn't do that. when i was installing xr i saw: "we respect the following legends" and mentioned many groups. they called Reloaded a legend? for what? the same Reloaded few weeks later writes idiotic 10 pages NFO with "loaders" story. i ask again: who TF they are to learn the scene what loader is and what it isn't? after scene discovered their cheating with cracks they should change the name and start new group
| Quote: | | No wonder Ultima didn't release much more, who'd want to be associated with a 'scene' that bitches at you for doing what no-one else could, because you didn't want to do it 'their' way. |
agree
| Quote: | | XR wasn't actually released via 'the scene' anyway, it was released on P2P scene took it and nuked it.... |
that's right. i remember it very well. that nuke should be called the most stupid nuke of the century, but hey, come on, nforce respected them with Colin so maybe times change? respect for nforce for respecting others style |
Pardon, XR/CMR areny fully cracked, protection is still there and i guess after all this "bitching about loaders" noone will ever release stuff like that .. maybe over p2p 
OH and I just checked reloaded, procdump'ed carbon clone and demo exes - rld/clone are kinda same and they are both totally different from demo exe which is bigger (pure code) by 700kb and totally different in content from it...
Btw: this thread is funny, noone prooves a thing.
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| Posted: Sun, 17th Apr 2005 02:46 Post subject: |
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To prove RLD cracked Second Sight: (I hope this one will be clear, because it's simple)
In the crack folder there's only one file... right ?
It's called secondsight.exe. This file is totaly decrypted when compared to the original file... And there are some new instruction put in there by the cracker...
The game has atleast one more file that is SF3 protected... That file is called secondsight.dll... This file isn't decrypted... It's the way it is in the original...
What does that mean... RLD rewrote secondsight.exe... to decrypt secondsight.dll (remove the protection), and every other encrypted file...
Every RLD SF3 crack works this way... (except SRS, but I'm not sure cause I don't have the game, so I don't know if it's beta or other shit)...
Hope it's clear now... and it'll end this beta/review bullshit...
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TheDuck
Posts: 148
Location: Australia
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| Posted: Sun, 17th Apr 2005 03:09 Post subject: |
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secondsight.dll = protection library (protect.dll)
When game is fully cracked this file is not needed anymore hence its not included in crack folder on the cd, in rare cases such like Blitzkrieg addon they included "fake" protect.dll since cracked exe was loading *.dll files from main dir, and when you try to load protect.dll it will "try" to check the cd and when you cancel the check it would close the game most likely.
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| Posted: Sun, 17th Apr 2005 09:11 Post subject: Re: Second Sight - RLD |
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| bigboy177 wrote: | Can someone please explain to me... Why there are so many crackers, so many ppl who say RLD didn't crack it... they just took exe from this or that... If they are so good, and know so much about protections and cracking, why won't they start cracking games by themselves...
They say that exes are from betas and shit like that... It only shows that they know shit about how SF3 works...
How can someone write such shit:
| HeroMan wrote: | | When do people understand that Silent Hunter is not cracked? Reloaded did a good job obtaining a unprotected .exe but it is not a cracked.exe |
Just look at the damn crack before you say anything... SH3 is cracked... there are many more files encrypted in the game and RLD changed exe and dlls to decrypt all files... So they cracked the game...
The same goes for kraudi04 and your bullshit about Second Sight... The Power of StarForce 3 is not in exe and one or two dlls but in encryption... There are many files throughout the game which need to be decrypted in order for the game to work... RLD changed exe to decrypt all of the files, without the stupid SF3 drivers... And stop this bullshit already... Think first and write later... |
I'm not getting into this flame debate now. All I have to say is so what if they know how to crack SF3 games? Everyone who can crack that stuff isnt always in a group. Or maybe their just sharing their knowledge here. I think you guys have to start to learn the logic of people who come here. Most of them do not care about if a game is cracked, or if the .exe is bypassed. They just want to play the game and dont care.
My guess is the mods didnt really want to make a forum dedicated to protection, but not much you can do when every single post in the PC Games forum is basically about SF3 instead of the games.
Another thing the groups were getting at to was that the "proper way of cracking a release" is not happening anymore. Groups are starting to accuse each other about only bypassing certain triggers and and thus making certain things in the game not work. Like sound and crashing to the desktop. I sort of agree things should be done right but at the same time I'm respectfull that the groups even release this stuff. But anyone who is in the scene pretty much knows what I'm talking about. Dont care if this racing or supplying because overtime you develope a conscious about whats going on, and actually have a right to say what you want to say. Than when you do speak your mind on here even if its about protections in general, you get flamed.
To me, its just not working out because you have idiots that come here. I can see it now. This forum is getting worse everyday with the flames and bashing on protection schemes.
| Quote: |
but why say something isnt a true crack based on some technicallity the "scene" created? |
Because it causes problems in the games. I already talked about that. It may not do it to EVERYBODY but it does it to a great amount of people. I've even seen tons of threads for games before that had loaders and people who had even fairly good graphic cards like 9800XT, not even being able to run it. But if it works for you, thats good. Technically, thats the same attitude what you said above that alot of people have now in the scene. Thats not good.
| Quote: |
man, that's exactly what i'm talking about. i really have nothing against Reloaded itself but when i saw their 10 pages NFO with "loaders" story i really got pissed because i knew their nukes caused by fake, betas or unprotected executables.... that's fucking cheating and i don't have any respect for such fakers |
I'd be pissed to. Thats pretty much what I was talking about above. Yea, in a sense it is cheating to win a race. For what? Its only going to be propered anyway. But keep in mind all their releases arent loaders. And some of the stories you cant really believe because you arent in RLD or HLM. That doesnt apply to the loaders not being in the games. Because it is true. Not to mention the fakes released under HLMS names before.
A perfect example of betas was way back a year ago. Maybe 2 years? If you remember the game Jedi Knight Academy. It was something like that. It was released as a beta during the summer a month ahead of time before its store release. There was alot of problems with it until people fixxed it, than went out to say its a BETA, so who cares about rules?
| Quote: |
Nah, releasing shit has been HLMs job recently |
I've heard people say ELEGANCE.
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| Posted: Sun, 17th Apr 2005 10:33 Post subject: |
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| Quote: | | Pardon, XR/CMR areny fully cracked, protection is still there |
don't make me cry, please
the best scene crackers can't even understand and learn the way xr got cracked but you did
you still mislead the word protection crack with protection removal
if XR isn't cracked and the protection is still there then please explain me how am I playing xr wihtout original dvd for over half a year?
crack is a crack and you talk about protection removal which i don't really care about. i hope you aren't another fanatic trumpeting: "SCCT can be cracked, but only the way Ultima did, so scene isn't interested" - please, at least not today.... it's sunday
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| Posted: Sun, 17th Apr 2005 13:19 Post subject: |
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Bashing at each other isn't really a point of disscusion... LAmBaDa, you've got really got points there... There have always been betas around... Far Cry was also released as beta, then DEV released a retail version...
The thing I don't understand is... when a game protected by SR, SD, or LL gets released everyone is like Good Job, Great Work blablabla... but when a game protected by SF3 gets released everything is different... everyone is bashing at each other and at groups... saying that it has exes from betas and stuff like that... when even most of them don't know what a debugger is... If it was so simple... - just to taking exes from betas, I think we wouldn't have to wait for these games so long... Suddenly from nowhere all these betas are running around, even for games 6 months old... I mean come on ppl wake up... One of beta testers would have released these games a long time ago... RLD didn't find all betas in one month...
I also don't care hov the game is cracked... If the game is running without the original CD/DVD, I'm fine...
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| Posted: Sun, 17th Apr 2005 14:04 Post subject: |
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| Quote: | | Bashing at each other isn't really a point of disscusion... LAmBaDa, you've got really got points there... |
i'm not bashing but ASKING those h3x0rs. of course almost all my questions stay unanswered because they are uncomfortable for some people
| Quote: | | The thing I don't understand is... when a game protected by SR, SD, or LL gets released everyone is like Good Job, Great Work blablabla... |
wrong. did you forget about Reloaded's Bible ("10" pages NFO)? they were attacking Hoodlum when HLD learned Safedisc and Securom. the problem is that Reloaded wants to be "da best". certainly they are da best but in faking
| Quote: | | RLD didn't find all betas in one month... |
i suppose they just hired the best beta and patch suppliers around da world - it's their tradition.... "fake or die"
| Quote: | | I also don't care hov the game is cracked... If the game is running without the original CD/DVD, I'm fine... |
the same here, but Reloaded fans and Reloaded itself tried, in a lamentable way, to introduce new scene law and rules...
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| Posted: Sun, 17th Apr 2005 14:30 Post subject: |
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@lAmBaDa
Have you not noticed that now for 3 or 4 RLD starforce 3 cracked releases they also have included the UPDATE ? so these can't be beta exes... only with this second sight game they could have checked in the trial exe to get clues so they can crack it a bit faster..but surerly they won't use beta exe for every release lol they might have did once with that race game but does not mean they do it for every game lol and besides in the Street racer syndicate NFO they do not even claim it was cracked..
However the aproach Reloaded did against Hoodlum the other time regarding safedisc4 was a little bit lame they could have talked a little bit more polite like Vengeance did to PCgame...
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TheDuck
Posts: 148
Location: Australia
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| Posted: Sun, 17th Apr 2005 14:46 Post subject: |
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Pardon, you ppl say so much about beta exes in releases, what about some proove? And as we all see reloaded cracks latest versions of the games, including updates if there are any.. not some betas.
@lambada: why youre bashing at reloaded so much if you "dont care how its done" ? i didnt see you bashing around at hoodlum - not even at their recent badly cracked sd4 game. Now I dunno much about hoodlum but we all know there's not much to like about them, unless...
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| Posted: Sun, 17th Apr 2005 14:58 Post subject: |
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| Quote: | | why youre bashing at reloaded so much if you "dont care how its done" |
did you read my posts and understand them or just read only? the same for proofs - want them? then read and UNDERSTAND this thread
regarding bashing: i'll remind you my quote (the first and last time, next time you have to read on your own):
| Quote: | | i really have nothing against Reloaded itself but when i saw their 10 pages NFO with "loaders" story i really got pissed because i knew their nukes caused by fake, betas or unprotected executables.... that's fucking cheating and i don't have any respect for such fakers |
| Quote: | | i didnt see you bashing around at hoodlum - not even at their recent badly cracked sd4 game. |
you really don't read posts or are Relofaked member. how many times i've to type the same sentence? everyone make mistakes. have u heard about CRACKFIX? this is a solution for bad cracks which naturally happen. why you ask about bad cracks? we don't talk here about good/bad cracks but pitiable Reloaded swindles.
have you ever wondered who was so stupid to release FAKE titles as Hoodlum? it's obvious, only the perfect FAKER can do that - Relofaked. now i hope you understand my point of view.
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| Posted: Sun, 17th Apr 2005 16:47 Post subject: |
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| MartinW wrote: | | Quote: | | Second Sight has pcodes... Obscure also... (I don't know about other games) So RLD cracks VM |
Then why they cannot crack Toca2, Xpand Rally, Colin 2005, Splinter Cell? No offence but it seems they cannot crack virtual machine.
Ultima releases appeared much later than retail dates so Reloaded had a lot of time to do it (even in Colin 2005 nfo you can read: "we gave you guys enough time to prove what you really are"). |
just to let you know ... to crack sf3 its not important to crack!!! the vm
its enough to trace into it and get the crypted sf3 opcodes that are protected. they get decrypted there. u can either do it the ultima way by cracking the dll and let the exe search the opcodes itself or the rld way to copy the opcode into the real exe ... thats just all ... for both u need a high level of knowledge about sf3.
The rld way if it would be used on cmr 2005 and xp rally would mean ages to crack it ... and u know the time both came dvd cloning wasnt possible like its now. you see the truth bitching crackers turns them into retirement like myself and thats the reason for less competition.
And when ultima is so good (and yes they are) then why dont they do more releases .... because theres isnt anymore possible. sf3 coders learned from their fault ... and thatswhy ultima is dead for ever ... just believe me!
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| Posted: Sun, 17th Apr 2005 16:53 Post subject: |
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| bigboy177 wrote: | To prove RLD cracked Second Sight: (I hope this one will be clear, because it's simple)
In the crack folder there's only one file... right ?
It's called secondsight.exe. This file is totaly decrypted when compared to the original file... And there are some new instruction put in there by the cracker...
The game has atleast one more file that is SF3 protected... That file is called secondsight.dll... This file isn't decrypted... It's the way it is in the original...
What does that mean... RLD rewrote secondsight.exe... to decrypt secondsight.dll (remove the protection), and every other encrypted file...
Every RLD SF3 crack works this way... (except SRS, but I'm not sure cause I don't have the game, so I don't know if it's beta or other shit)...
Hope it's clear now... and it'll end this beta/review bullshit... |
yes somehow ur true and somehow wrong .. rld doesnt patch the exe to get into the dll .... u can even delete the dll after applying rld patches ... thats how they fool the vm of sf3 ... copying all needed vm stuff into the main exe.
and btw. scct wont make ubisoft happy ... as its slow like hell when u have not an high end machine.
Stop bullshiting about crackers do bad jobs or so .... rld made faults, hoodlum did, so did razor .. and ultima didnt ... and will never do as they are dead because to many ppl in this forums here fucked them about their cracking way! it wasnt rld that fucked them it was nforce ... think about it!
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| Posted: Sun, 17th Apr 2005 16:57 Post subject: |
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| Posted: Sun, 17th Apr 2005 16:59 Post subject: |
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| Posted: Sun, 17th Apr 2005 17:20 Post subject: |
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| bigboy177 wrote: | A very simple way to check if the protection was cracked... And simple enough for every one to understand... Cause you don't have to RE exes... Sometimes the simplest ways are the hardest to find... 
| olger901 wrote: | Just played it, cool game and features, though the controls are clumsy and graphics aren't that great either.
BTW: Here is some proof that the executables from the Second.Sight-RELOADED release are protected with Starforce 3.4.62. So now please stop all the rumours and the bitching about it, because it's cracked.
secondsight.exe = The cracked exe
secondsighta.exe = The original exe
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I just checked all of the cracked RLD exes... (They can be found on GCW)... Each of them has SF3... Betas or review versions wouldn't have SF3 inside... That's a great proof that RLD can infact crack SF3... |
When did anyone say RLD couldn't break SF3?
There are many flavours, various buttons on the SF protection wizard that can be ticked no doubt. It's a known fact some review / beta versions come with the basic SF wrapper, which is not particularly strong in the grand scheme, certainly not a match for the wrapper based protections.
A-Ray's check is a fairly quick and simple one, probably nothing more than a check for a .sforce section in the EXE, nothing too strenuous.
Regarding how deep into SF3 RLD can go, some versions of SF3 like any other program have bugs in them which allow people to make them act in ways they wouldn't normally.
Enough about pcodes already, SF3 protections are more than just how big the VM is, it's also how that VM is protected and what the SF3 code does to frustrate debugging.
Might be a good time for this thread to go to sleep before it becomes even more of a haven for FUD.
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| Posted: Sun, 17th Apr 2005 17:39 Post subject: |
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| Quote: | | And when ultima is so good (and yes they are) then why dont they do more releases .... because theres isnt anymore possible |
And if you are so good as you claim (a cracker - lol) then why do not you read NFOs? Did you not notice Ultima message? They told that they have nothing common with the scene and will not release anything more. Stop being so big head. It does not look serious.
| Quote: | | rld made faults, hoodlum did, so did razor .. and ultima didnt ... and will never do as they are dead because to many ppl in this forums here fucked them about their cracking way! it wasnt rld that fucked them it was nforce ... think about it! |
Yes, you are right.
| Quote: | | Might be a good time for this thread to go to sleep before it becomes even more of a haven for FUD. |
Again, agree.
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