Just watched the news while I was eating dinner, and as usual there is a section on the news about starving people in Africa. It was about the war in Somalia, and that my government (swedish) are going to send extra money down there to help out.
Anyway, I have seen these kind of news reports since I was born (almost). I was born in the early 80s and I'm starting to find myself less and less empathic about the people in Africa. I mean there is always some kind of starvation, always some kind of war, massacre and so on.
So, I'm just wondering how do you all feel about it? Do you get sad when you see it? Do you care?
Sure, call me a bastard for not caring (as much) anymore, but right now I'm just more worried about stuff on my hometurf here in Sweden. It kinda drains you to be worrying about everything and everyone. And all those help organisations that plays with your feelings, making sure you feel like a bastard living in a "rich" country.
/Thomas
Last edited by tomme on Thu, 21st Jul 2011 19:44; edited 1 time in total
we are bastards living in a rich country. i grew up over there so i guess i've seen both sides, which sort of sits with you in everything you do. you get a perspective on things.
what problems are you talking about? imho, we are just spoiled people
we are bastards living in a rich country. i grew up over there so i guess i've seen both sides, which sort of sits with you in everything you do. you get a perspective on things.
what problems are you talking about? imho, we are just spoiled people
Yeah, I guess. I have never seen or experienced it. One of my parents have tough.
You mean problems here? High crime rate in my town, many people unemployed / people getting poorer and more desprate. Government trying to silence our opionions on diffrent matters. Drug use going rampant.
well, we (the "1st world") raped the colonies back then and left them in that state, so it's only logical that we should send aid/money down there or at least care about it.
only problem is that no matter how much gets sent to the 3rd world, it rarely changes something about the root of the whole problem and in the worst case, ends up in some warlord's bank account.
well, we (the "1st world") raped the colonies back then and left them in that state, so it's only logical that we should send aid/money down there or at least care about it.
only problem is that no matter how much gets sent to the 3rd world, it rarely changes something about the root of the whole problem and in the worst case, ends up in some warlord's bank account.
You mean problems here? High crime rate in my town, many people unemployed / people getting poorer and more desprate. Government trying to silence our opionions on diffrent matters. Drug use going rampant.
We wont fix any of these problems by stop helping other countries, or switching channel =]
I think people in (large) parts of Africa are essentially still hunter gatherers. They try to mimic the Western world but really have no idea how to build a stable society. The result is sheer anarchy. I think this also explains why a relatively large amount of Africans that have immigrated to the West, end up having socio-economic problems.
Then there's the theory about us exploiting Africa in the good old colonial times. I think this proves my point even more. If people in Africa would be doing more planning and organizing, they would already have build up a society. They wouldn't be helpless sitting ducks in the 17th century anymore. So colonialism certainly has made matters worse, but I think the Africans themselves have done and are doing far too little to develop their society.
This makes me wonder: 50 years from now, will I still be looking at the same poverty and war in Africa? I'm afraid I will if they won't change their attitude radically.
Lopin18 wrote:
I think you played too much Fallout 3, Pedo Perk acquired.
I see a lot of arrogance and a lack of insight among various humpers when it comes to the complexity behind the way things are in for instance various African countries (just the mere fact that Africa is treated like a country by many proves my point).
You mean problems here? High crime rate in my town, many people unemployed / people getting poorer and more desprate. Government trying to silence our opionions on diffrent matters. Drug use going rampant.
We wont fix any of these problems by stop helping other countries, or switching channel =]
I guess. But the problem is that government (at least here in sweden) are more inclined to help other nations than spend money on problems a little closer to home. I'm not just talking about sending money to africa, but the whole EU project thing..
I see a lot of arrogance and a lack of insight among various humpers when it comes to the complexity behind the way things are in for instance various African countries (just the mere fact that Africa is treated like a country by many proves my point).
I think most of us know that Africa is a continent. But you can't deny that Africa as a whole is riddled with wars and unjustice.
Should I have to feel guilt cos another country has problems? I was born into my life, I can't be blamed for what happens in the world.
I used to give money to charity - but after reading about how much money actually arrives to where its needed I realized that it really isnt the best thing to do. What we do need is to send people down to poor countries and educate them. Bringing them to our western world wont really help in the long run other than for the people we get here...and we cannot bring them all here.
Help them build up their countries by sending down workers with good education and teachers to help them get better instead imo.
If we do send them money it will proberbly end up in the hands of the wrong people anyhow.
My mothers mate used to send loads of money every year down to a family in Africa. When he finally got around to visit them it turned out that the town major had taken every single euro they'd sent down there and the same with money others had sent to the village - and bought cars and a nice home to himself.
Bastards.
Edit: Thought I might add that it's the western worlds fault that the situation is the way that it is in Africa (partly). Just check how nicely drawn the borders between the lands our. The western conquerors thought they could split it how they wanted instead of checking how the tribes had it. But ofc, thats only part of the problem.
shitloads of new stuff in my pc. Cant keep track of it all.
I see a lot of arrogance and a lack of insight among various humpers when it comes to the complexity behind the way things are in for instance various African countries (just the mere fact that Africa is treated like a country by many proves my point).
I think most of us know that Africa is a continent. But you can't deny that Africa as a whole is riddled with wars and unjustice.
I see Africa as two parts, divided by the Sahara. North-Africa and sub saharan Africa. Or black Africa, but some people believe nomenclature based on colour of skin may lead to ethnic cleansing.
Lopin18 wrote:
I think you played too much Fallout 3, Pedo Perk acquired.
Should I have to feel guilt cos another country has problems? I was born into my life, I can't be blamed for what happens in the world.
I used to give money to charity - but after reading about how much money actually arrives to where its needed I realized that it really isnt the best thing to do. What we do need is to send people down to poor countries and educate them. Bringing them to our western world wont really help in the long run other than for the people we get here...and we cannot bring them all here.
Help them build up their countries by sending down workers with good education and teachers to help them get better instead imo.
If we do send them money it will proberbly end up in the hands of the wrong people anyhow.
My mothers mate used to send loads of money every year down to a family in Africa. When he finally got around to visit them it turned out that the town major had taken every single euro they'd sent down there and the same with money others had sent to the village - and bought cars and a nice home to himself.
Bastards.
Edit: Thought I might add that it's the western worlds fault that the situation is the way that it is in Africa (partly). Just check how nicely drawn the borders between the lands our. The western conquerors thought they could split it how they wanted instead of checking how the tribes had it. But ofc, thats only part of the problem.
Tribes and boundaries... Look what happened to Belgium: the Flemish and Wallonians are struggling to create a government for well over a year now
Lopin18 wrote:
I think you played too much Fallout 3, Pedo Perk acquired.
I see a lot of arrogance and a lack of insight among various humpers when it comes to the complexity behind the way things are in for instance various African countries (just the mere fact that Africa is treated like a country by many proves my point).
I know, I have a controversial or even extreme view on Africa. But I think Africa itself is a continent of extremes. Nowhere on the planet are so many problems as in Africa. War, famine, disease, overpopulation. The list goes on. Sadly misery seems to have become the common denominator for many African countries. I think that's the reason some people see Africa as a single country.
Islam is also dominant in North Africa, but I don't consider islam a problem.
Lopin18 wrote:
I think you played too much Fallout 3, Pedo Perk acquired.
id never give them any of my money, all they do is fuck and fight, why should we give them money to keep producing babies, i say leave them to it, let them die and maybe one day they will learn that fucking and fighting costs money.
Should I have to feel guilt cos another country has problems? I was born into my life, I can't be blamed for what happens in the world.
I used to give money to charity - but after reading about how much money actually arrives to where its needed I realized that it really isnt the best thing to do. What we do need is to send people down to poor countries and educate them. Bringing them to our western world wont really help in the long run other than for the people we get here...and we cannot bring them all here.
Help them build up their countries by sending down workers with good education and teachers to help them get better instead imo.
If we do send them money it will proberbly end up in the hands of the wrong people anyhow.
My mothers mate used to send loads of money every year down to a family in Africa. When he finally got around to visit them it turned out that the town major had taken every single euro they'd sent down there and the same with money others had sent to the village - and bought cars and a nice home to himself.
Bastards.
Edit: Thought I might add that it's the western worlds fault that the situation is the way that it is in Africa (partly). Just check how nicely drawn the borders between the lands our. The western conquerors thought they could split it how they wanted instead of checking how the tribes had it. But ofc, thats only part of the problem.
Help them build up their countries... What baffles me is that Western Europeans have build op their own countries without any help. How did they manage to do that? Then they went overseas and did the same trick again in America, Australia and New Zealand. Why are people in Africa and non Western countries in general, having such difficulties building a society?
Lopin18 wrote:
I think you played too much Fallout 3, Pedo Perk acquired.
id never give them any of my money, all they do is fuck and fight, why should we give them money to keep producing babies, i say leave them to it, let them die and maybe one day they will learn that fucking and fighting costs money.
Poor people make a lot of babies. This wasn't any different in Western countries. Overpopulation is a ticking time bomb in Africa of course. They can't feed themselves right now, how the hell are they going to support a population that will be 5-10x as large?
Lopin18 wrote:
I think you played too much Fallout 3, Pedo Perk acquired.
Should I have to feel guilt cos another country has problems? I was born into my life, I can't be blamed for what happens in the world.
I used to give money to charity - but after reading about how much money actually arrives to where its needed I realized that it really isnt the best thing to do. What we do need is to send people down to poor countries and educate them. Bringing them to our western world wont really help in the long run other than for the people we get here...and we cannot bring them all here.
Help them build up their countries by sending down workers with good education and teachers to help them get better instead imo.
If we do send them money it will proberbly end up in the hands of the wrong people anyhow.
My mothers mate used to send loads of money every year down to a family in Africa. When he finally got around to visit them it turned out that the town major had taken every single euro they'd sent down there and the same with money others had sent to the village - and bought cars and a nice home to himself.
Bastards.
Edit: Thought I might add that it's the western worlds fault that the situation is the way that it is in Africa (partly). Just check how nicely drawn the borders between the lands our. The western conquerors thought they could split it how they wanted instead of checking how the tribes had it. But ofc, thats only part of the problem.
Help them build up their countries... What baffles me is that Western Europeans have build op their own countries without any help. How did they manage to do that? Then they went overseas and did the same trick again in America, Australia and New Zealand. Why are people in Africa and non Western countries in general, having such difficulties building a society?
Ofcourse - but since the situation is the way it is now...and I'd hopefully if they ever get their countries to "work" they will stop immigrating. I'd rather see their countries have their golden ages than having them here unemployed.
Atm the world is more or less in an economical crisis. USA is on the brink of total mayhem with their incredible debt and greece is even closer. Iceland went over the edge ages ago. Really, it wont get better if we bring them here. Sure we will help the ones who flee - but instead we make it even hard for the rest of us to live. Nothing racist about this reasoning - just plain facts.
Their countries sure as hell wont get better just cos the majority of them flee.
shitloads of new stuff in my pc. Cant keep track of it all.
id never give them any of my money, all they do is fuck and fight, why should we give them money to keep producing babies, i say leave them to it, let them die and maybe one day they will learn that fucking and fighting costs money.
Poor people make a lot of babies. This wasn't any different in Western countries. Overpopulation is a ticking time bomb in Africa of course. They can't feed themselves right now, how the hell are they going to support a population that will be 5-10x as large?
Exactly. Unfortunatly thats how poverty works. Strangly enough the population breed more when being poor and belive it or not - poor people spend more money on stupid things like sweeties and shit than rich ones..
I guess when you have nothing at all to live for the only way to have fun is by shagging as if there is no tomorrow. Too bad they don't seem to give a fuck about their kids future. Really - are these the kind of people we want to help? If they don't care about their future - why should we help them? And THATS why we need to educate them (in their own countries...cos if we bring them here they wont go back and the whole point is lost. Nothing against immigrants, but they really need to get their motherlands back on track rather than just flee).
shitloads of new stuff in my pc. Cant keep track of it all.
...I feel abit like a parrot now..cos when I check through what i just wrote it seems like im just saying the same thing over and over again lol! Sorry bout that!
shitloads of new stuff in my pc. Cant keep track of it all.
...I feel abit like a parrot now..cos when I check through what i just wrote it seems like im just saying the same thing over and over again lol! Sorry bout that!
nah keep posting, dont let them switch channel! xD
id never give them any of my money, all they do is fuck and fight, why should we give them money to keep producing babies, i say leave them to it, let them die and maybe one day they will learn that fucking and fighting costs money.
Poor people make a lot of babies. This wasn't any different in Western countries. Overpopulation is a ticking time bomb in Africa of course. They can't feed themselves right now, how the hell are they going to support a population that will be 5-10x as large?
Exactly. Unfortunatly thats how poverty works. Strangly enough the population breed more when being poor and belive it or not - poor people spend more money on stupid things like sweeties and shit than rich ones..
I guess when you have nothing at all to live for the only way to have fun is by shagging as if there is no tomorrow. Too bad they don't seem to give a fuck about their kids future. Really - are these the kind of people we want to help? If they don't care about their future - why should we help them? And THATS why we need to educate them (in their own countries...cos if we bring them here they wont go back and the whole point is lost. Nothing against immigrants, but they really need to get their motherlands back on track rather than just flee).
Shaging like there's no tomorrow... lol. I've read a feature in the newspaper about morals and sex in Kenya. People are too poor to buy condoms of a decent brand. Heck they are too poor to buy a new condom each time... so they use them over and over again. Just use a little detergent and water and the condom is good as new.
So person 1 has just cleaned his condom and has hung it on the washing line to dry. The dude next door comes home from school and says,
"Hello neighbour I've met a nice girl at school can I use your condom for a moment?"
-"Of course!"
10 minutes later the condom with "content" is returned for cleaning.
Well at least they ARE using protection, sort of.
Lopin18 wrote:
I think you played too much Fallout 3, Pedo Perk acquired.
Why are people in Africa and non Western countries in general, having such difficulties building a society?
Does it seem to you that Japan, China, South Korea, Russia, Hungary, Slovenia, Slovakia, Bulgaria, Romania, Ukraine, etc. have difficulties in building a society ? Have you actually ever been in any of these countries, or at least somewhere in Eastern Europe (should be closer to you), to see how those people actually live ? I still cannot fathom how can you throw these sentences with a straight face, without any argument. Spare me the Western superiority idea, i spent quite some time in Germany (Karlsruhe), Italy (Rome), France (Paris) - and they all have their issues (with racism and xenophoby really popping out). I was actually talking one day with an Indian nuclear safety teacher, and she told me in Bruxelles, Belgium, that she was asking for directions and people were literally running from her, thinking she was a gipsy hellbent on stealing their money.
You seem to talk only about stuff you've seen in the news, on TV, newspapers. I'm only asking : have you actually lived anywhere else than Western Europe, in any of these countries you seem to belittle so much ?
I'm not really talking about the reason for the troubles, or how to solve it. Most of us know why it is as it is. I mean culture clashes as some of you said is common here at home aswell. Look at former Yugoslavia.
My question was; do you care?
I mean, ofcourse it's horrible. Starving to death is one of most painful deaths. Slow miserably death. The killing of thousands of innocents in strange wars is also bad. I have seen so many pictures of mass graves on the news...
But for me it just feels like the world is beyond fuckt at the moment. So many diffrent people to worry about. Wars and uprisings everywhere, and at the same time we have help organisations that profit from it. There was a huge scandal here in Sweden a while ago. A CEO of a organisation took alot of money for himself. And something about 50% of the collected money goes to administration.
I helped a friend with a cleaning job. We had to clean the offices of "Rädda Barnen" (a organisation that helps children). They just moved to some new offices in the middle of my town in one of the most expensive districts. The office complex was huge and looked very expensive. Things like that makes me bitter. Do they really need that? They are supposed to help children only.
Anyway. With so much destruction going on all over the place makes me feel empty and sad. To the point "is it really worth caring? Will it ever get better?"
lol I thought this thread was from 1984 the news has been reporting about starving people in Africa for decades. And unsurprisingly we would much rather spend money to play army than fix the worlds problems.....
Reality is merely an illusion, albeit a very persistent one
Why are people in Africa and non Western countries in general, having such difficulties building a society?
Does it seem to you that Japan, China, South Korea, Russia, Hungary, Slovenia, Slovakia, Bulgaria, Romania, Ukraine, etc. have difficulties in building a society ? Have you actually ever been in any of these countries, or at least somewhere in Eastern Europe (should be closer to you), to see how those people actually live ? I still cannot fathom how can you throw these sentences with a straight face, without any argument. Spare me the Western superiority idea, i spent quite some time in Germany (Karlsruhe), Italy (Rome), France (Paris) - and they all have their issues (with racism and xenophoby really popping out). I was actually talking one day with an Indian nuclear safety teacher, and she told me in Bruxelles, Belgium, that she was asking for directions and people were literally running from her, thinking she was a gipsy hellbent on stealing their money.
You seem to talk only about stuff you've seen in the news, on TV, newspapers. I'm only asking : have you actually lived anywhere else than Western Europe, in any of these countries you seem to belittle so much ?
I could give a long answer, but long story short: why drag Eastern Europe into this discussion about misery in Africa? I certainly do not believe Eastern Europe is like Africa.
I also believe it's rather different from Western Europe -- but that's a different matter altogether. If you would like to discuss negative stereotypes about Eastern Europe among Westerners, I think it's best to open a new topic.
Lopin18 wrote:
I think you played too much Fallout 3, Pedo Perk acquired.
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