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TSR69
Banned
Posts: 14962
Location: Republic of the Seven United Provinces
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 Posted: Thu, 4th Apr 2013 03:31 Post subject: |
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Hmm no one taught me to handle money either, but it is just simple arithmetic. Don't spend more than you get in the regular interval in which you acquire a certain amount. Btw you can get "bijzondere bijstand" for having "bewindvoering".
Formerly known as iconized
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TheSaint
Dalai Lama
Posts: 6586
Location: Cook Islands
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| Posted: Thu, 4th Apr 2013 08:04 Post subject: |
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| sausje wrote: | Yeah more or less like that.
I never was able to manage my own money, because noone ever teached me.
Went to a couple of private companies that handle finances, but they got me further into trouble.
So my only option was "Bewindvoering", this was done voluntary by me and i had to agree in court in order to get this.
The problem is that there is no difference being made if i had to do this voluntary or not..
And the other problem is that complaining about such a company to the judge is a pain in the ass process that rather wants you to just give up... |
Sned a verzoekschrift to the court stating that the reason for your bewindvoering is gone and that you have learned how to handle your money in a non greek way.
Artikel 449Beëindigen bewind
1.Het bewind eindigt door het verstrijken van de tijdsduur waarvoor het is ingesteld en door de dood of ondercuratelestelling van de rechthebbende.
2.De kantonrechter kan, indien de oorzaken die tot de onderbewindstelling aanleiding hebben gegeven, niet meer bestaan, het bewind opheffen op verzoek van de rechthebbende of het openbaar ministerie; de beschikking treedt in werking zodra zij in kracht van gewijsde is gegaan, tenzij zij een eerder tijdstip van ingang aanwijst.
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TheSaint
Dalai Lama
Posts: 6586
Location: Cook Islands
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| Posted: Thu, 4th Apr 2013 08:08 Post subject: |
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And to be direct with you, the mere fact you havent been taught how to use money is in my opinion a weak argument for fucking up so much. It isnt really rocketcience right? I know that some circumstances can make it more difficult but it should be quite basic. I have made the following case for you, if you answer correctly you should stop the bewindvoering:
John earns 400 dollars in a month. He has 200 dollars in fixed costs every month. How much money can John spend if he wants to save 50 dollars per month?
A: 200
B: 400
C: 150
D: 50
 Spoiler: | If you live in Greece the answer is B, but since your dutch the answer is C.  |
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deelix
PDIP Member
Posts: 32062
Location: Norway
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| Posted: Thu, 4th Apr 2013 08:26 Post subject: |
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| sausje wrote: | I'm forced to do so by the gov, "Bewindvoering" is what we call it here..
I got no choice in that matter...
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What the flying fuck, and I thought NL was a "free" country :/
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| Posted: Thu, 4th Apr 2013 08:34 Post subject: |
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| deelix wrote: | | sausje wrote: | I'm forced to do so by the gov, "Bewindvoering" is what we call it here..
I got no choice in that matter...
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What the flying fuck, and I thought NL was a "free" country :/ |
he wanted to make sound like it's gov's fault, but as other people pointed out later, looks like he fucked up big time and gov is actually helping him, yet he still whines and bitches.
maybe if he didn't spend all day trolling internet forum and got a decent job...
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spankie
VIP Member
Posts: 2958
Location: Belgium
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| Posted: Thu, 4th Apr 2013 10:51 Post subject: |
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When I was studying I managed to survive with 50 euros a week (my parents paid for housing). Noone ever told me how to manage my money, but it ain't that difficult when you almost have none, you just learn it by doing. O look, a 200 euro pants. Hmm, I can eat for 4 weeks, or buy the pants, not a really difficult decision... Or, look a 20 euro Nokia cellphone or a 500 euro iPhone. If you have no money, those choices are not real choices.
When I started my first job I enjoyed some luxury (buy decent beer instead of the cheapest crap, buy real ice tea instead of cheap crap, buy a computer game instead of downloading everything, buy car, buy tv etc). All together I maybe spent 100-150 per week for everything non-housing related. Took me a while to know what to spend my money on and enjoy life a little bit. Nowadays, I am still able to save 30%-40% of my income.
I really dunno what people spend their money on. I mean, even if you have a crap job and try to cut down on living expenses (who needs a 4 room apartment as single?), you should have more than enough to live relatively decently in NL, BE, FR, DE, etc. My only big expenses are my travelling and mountaineering expenses. And yeah, I've spend $300 in a wild night in Vegas once, but that's as far as crazy shit goes.
And btw, why would you spend 110 per month to have a dude manage your payments? The only guy who has access to my bank account is my banker who gets access to all my money on my savings account above a certain threshold to invest. His cut ? The first 2% of the profits he generates.
!!Money problems are not fixed with money (110 in your case) but with a change in attitude!!
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Saner
Posts: 6877
Location: Uk
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| Posted: Thu, 4th Apr 2013 11:23 Post subject: |
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I left home at 16, I learnt.
Sure I made mistakes, but then I learnt from them.
Its always someone else's fault.
| ragnarus wrote: |
I saw things like that in here and in other "woman problems" topics so...... Am I the only one that thinks some authorities needs to be alerted about Saner and him possibly being a rapist and/or kidnapper ? |
Saner is not being serious. Unless its the subject of Santa!
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sausje
Banned
Posts: 17716
Location: Limboland, Netherlands
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| Posted: Thu, 4th Apr 2013 12:47 Post subject: |
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@TheSaint
I'm already going to take this to court and hopefully see him punished.
Made some calls yesterday and i'm going to someone else to handle this. This person aswell is going to help me to become independent with money, so with a little luck, at the end of this year, i should be able to take care of my own.
I was really sick of it and decided that 2013 is going to be the year that i overthrow my old habits and finally grow the fuck up.
| Intel_NVIDIA wrote: | | deelix wrote: | | sausje wrote: | I'm forced to do so by the gov, "Bewindvoering" is what we call it here..
I got no choice in that matter...
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What the flying fuck, and I thought NL was a "free" country :/ |
he wanted to make sound like it's gov's fault, but as other people pointed out later, looks like he fucked up big time and gov is actually helping him, yet he still whines and bitches.
maybe if he didn't spend all day trolling internet forum and got a decent job... |
As usual derp_derpidia is blabbering bullshit comments without knowing ANYTHING at all about my situation, pathetic little kid
If you would had actually bothered to even read ANYTHING at all, you would had known as to why i don't have a job and why i really hate the gov here.
All i'm going to say now, feel proud you just said that to a handicapped guy, feel really proud kiddo! Shows people what sort of person you really are, just because we disagree one some things, you are taking this personal now and taking cheap shots without knowing anything at all, so pathetic
But deelix, it was my own free choice to do so, but since i decided that, i'm now stuck with it. I could ask them if i can have my own money again, but then they need to assess my current situation. And since i have debts atm (wich are gone in a couple of month), it ain't going to happen..
If i would had handled my own money back then, i would had spend all on weed and would had prolly be homeless by now.
So to protect myself against myself, i decided that it was the best thing to do at the time.
| spankie wrote: | | !!Money problems are not fixed with money (110 in your case) but with a change in attitude!! |
I know this very well, and over the past ~8 years living on my own, has changed me a great deal.
The problem is that the people around me don't believe that people change, they don't want to give me a chance.
My mom the other day, i told her that i wanted to be independent with my money and other things, she laughed at me and said "you can't do that". So yeah, that's the kind of motivation i'm getting from family and the people i have to see.
I even went back to the UWV to get retested, i told them that i'm certain that i'm not a category 80-100% "arbeidsongeschikt", yet after the tests, they said that i did improve, but still am a category 80-100%..
So you see, i'm motivating myself to do alot of things, but everyone around me doesn't seem to want that and keep blocking me in every way i try..
Proud member of Frustrated Association of International Losers Failing Against the Gifted and Superior (F.A.I.L.F.A.G.S)
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| Posted: Thu, 4th Apr 2013 12:57 Post subject: |
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| deelix wrote: | | sausje wrote: | I'm forced to do so by the gov, "Bewindvoering" is what we call it here..
I got no choice in that matter...
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What the flying fuck, and I thought NL was a "free" country :/ |
I don't know sausje's situation, so I'll make a general comment. Something like this usually only happens when you fuck up royally. It's pretty much the last resort to get a person's finances in check. Instead of hitting you with the economic banhammer, the government tries to take control of your finances untill debts are paid. "Debts" in this case are not bank loans, but essential things like social security payments, rent etc. The government can't just randomly take control of your finances, there needs to be a reason. If you are on wellfare, the threshold will obviously be much lower.
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sausje
Banned
Posts: 17716
Location: Limboland, Netherlands
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| Posted: Thu, 4th Apr 2013 13:12 Post subject: |
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| Posted: Thu, 4th Apr 2013 16:15 Post subject: |
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Dude that is waaay too much personal information to put up on the internet. Have you no consideration for your own privacy ? =)
Per Ardua Ad Astra
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Ankh
Posts: 23357
Location: Trelleborg
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TSR69
Banned
Posts: 14962
Location: Republic of the Seven United Provinces
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| Posted: Thu, 4th Apr 2013 16:59 Post subject: |
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Well sausje this is just another thread where you try to justify your own failures or blame it on others. I sincerely doubt you had a good youth and responsible caretakers but in the end you are somewhere in your 20s. You have to take responsibility yourself. If you want a job, just go to a job agency (uitzendburo). Depending on education there might be some work. Perhaps not very nice work but while making money you can try to improve yourself and get a better job. This is how it works for everyone else as well.
Edit: I have to add here that I am a bit of a hypocrite here.
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| Posted: Thu, 4th Apr 2013 18:40 Post subject: |
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If he's classified as "unfit", no job agency will accept him. He's stuck with the governmental instancies. I know plenty of people who are in these "trajects", as they are beautifully called. You guys have no idea how hard it is to get anything done when you're "unfit" and how hard it is to get out of these government projects. A lot of people in the lowest regions of the Dutch wellfare system are actually completely stuck i that position. Try getting anything done with UWV for example, it's like talking to a brick wall.
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TSR69
Banned
Posts: 14962
Location: Republic of the Seven United Provinces
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| Posted: Thu, 4th Apr 2013 18:50 Post subject: |
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You mean there is some court order that actually forbids him to find a job. Something like a RM (rechterlijke machtiging) or he has a guardian? Hmm the constitutional right to self-determination needs a legal process to get revoked and this doesn't happen without a reason.
Edit: Replaced custodian with guardian
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sausje
Banned
Posts: 17716
Location: Limboland, Netherlands
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| Posted: Thu, 4th Apr 2013 23:35 Post subject: |
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| TSR69 wrote: | | Well sausje this is just another thread where you try to justify your own failures or blame it on others. |
Not fully, there are others to blame, mistakes have been made, both by me and others.
I'm working hard to become "normal" and to become fully independent from others, but it's not as easy as you might think.
But for someone that doesn't have what i have, it's quite easy to solve everything with words 
Trust me on this: I want nothing more then to improve myself and become "normal", so that i can laugh at those that think it was impossible for me to do so. But once you got kicked back into the well every time your about to get out of it is really demotivating, and that didn't happen just once or twice or even ten time, but shitloads of more times and i'm getting really tired of it.. REALLY tired...
| Mister_s wrote: | | If he's classified as "unfit", no job agency will accept him. He's stuck with the governmental instancies. I know plenty of people who are in these "trajects", as they are beautifully called. You guys have no idea how hard it is to get anything done when you're "unfit" and how hard it is to get out of these government projects. A lot of people in the lowest regions of the Dutch wellfare system are actually completely stuck i that position. Try getting anything done with UWV for example, it's like talking to a brick wall. |
Finally someone who gets it.
The exact reason why i'm forced to do it via a judge, talking to them is pointless and gets me nowhere 
| TSR69 wrote: | | You mean there is some court order that actually forbids him to find a job. |
Technically not, but if i do, then they say that i would had been able to work all the time already and fine me for every penny i got from the gov since i was 18..
80-100% is in their eyes useless and not worth investing in because we simply "can't work in a normal environment"
Proud member of Frustrated Association of International Losers Failing Against the Gifted and Superior (F.A.I.L.F.A.G.S)
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Werelds
Special Little Man
Posts: 15098
Location: 0100111001001100
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| Posted: Thu, 4th Apr 2013 23:59 Post subject: |
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| sausje wrote: | | Mister_s wrote: | | If he's classified as "unfit", no job agency will accept him. He's stuck with the governmental instancies. I know plenty of people who are in these "trajects", as they are beautifully called. You guys have no idea how hard it is to get anything done when you're "unfit" and how hard it is to get out of these government projects. A lot of people in the lowest regions of the Dutch wellfare system are actually completely stuck i that position. Try getting anything done with UWV for example, it's like talking to a brick wall. |
Finally someone who gets it.
The exact reason why i'm forced to do it via a judge, talking to them is pointless and gets me nowhere |
And to make matters worse, there's tons of perfectly "fit" people that don't want to work yet can get jobs Saus would be perfectly happy with. Instead, they really do leech off tax payer's money.
You know where I stand on this Saus, so I'll leave it at that.
@ Ragedoctor: you clearly don't get the situation he's in, so just shut up. |
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sausje
Banned
Posts: 17716
Location: Limboland, Netherlands
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| Posted: Fri, 5th Apr 2013 00:00 Post subject: |
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You just keep thinking that Ragedoctor, you seem to be so butthurt about so many things, that i really think that your some sort of grumpy senior that always bitches about how life used to be and how fucked up it has become, while sitting at home infront of the window with the geraniums all alone shouting at the youth.
Not gonna waste my time justifying what i do and say towards you anymore.
| Werelds wrote: | | sausje wrote: | | Mister_s wrote: | | If he's classified as "unfit", no job agency will accept him. He's stuck with the governmental instancies. I know plenty of people who are in these "trajects", as they are beautifully called. You guys have no idea how hard it is to get anything done when you're "unfit" and how hard it is to get out of these government projects. A lot of people in the lowest regions of the Dutch wellfare system are actually completely stuck i that position. Try getting anything done with UWV for example, it's like talking to a brick wall. |
Finally someone who gets it.
The exact reason why i'm forced to do it via a judge, talking to them is pointless and gets me nowhere |
And to make matters worse, there's tons of perfectly "fit" people that don't want to work yet can get jobs Saus would be perfectly happy with. Instead, they really do leech off tax payer's money.
You know where I stand on this Saus, so I'll leave it at that. |
And to make it even more worse, my sister is one of them.
Once she found out that, as single mom, she could pull so much money from the gov and others that she didn't had to work anymore, she stopped working and didn't bother to go back to it.
She get's now around €1600-1700 euro each month for doing fuck all, JUST because shes a single mom!
She's a perfect example of one of those leeches..
And that's the problem, many do this and put the ones that truly are in a shit situation in the same place as them, making people on the outside think EVERYONE is just like them and EVERYONE is lying just so he/she doesn't have to work..
| m3th0d2008 wrote: | | sausje wrote: | Yep, born in Aachen  |
Seriously, I don't know if it's Wellfare what you're getting but if that's the case... get your ass over here. NL's Wellfare sounds even more horrid than ours. |
Sorry i didn't see your reply there.
I have thought about moving to Germany, but how is that going to solve anything?
I'll prolly end up in the same situation again (altho i have no idea how the company handling handicapped people in Germany actually is compared to UWV here)
The other problem is that i have nobody in Germany that i know, so i would be all alone there and that's no good thing either. Ofc i have part of my family there, but ever since my dad walked out on us, we never really bonded, so i have no idea how they would react if i suddenly became part of their life again.
Proud member of Frustrated Association of International Losers Failing Against the Gifted and Superior (F.A.I.L.F.A.G.S)
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| Posted: Fri, 5th Apr 2013 01:03 Post subject: |
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The problem is that government agencies only work when you don't need them, i.e. when everything is fine. The moment you need them however, you're pretty much fucked. I was in bureaucracy hell for four months due to IND, to get a visum for my fiancee. We are both highly educated and 25+, it was a highly unpleasant experience. UWV for example works exactly in the same manner, no one gives a shit about the personal situation. Such agencies are stuck with rules and regulations, quotas and some dipshit personalities. You're pretty much praying the guy handling your case is a decent human being. Everything is great, wellfare is for lazy assholes and people not working are homos....untill you're one of those people and are stuck in paper valhalla.
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MAD_MAX333
Moderator
Posts: 7020
Location: Toronto, Canada...eh
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| Posted: Fri, 5th Apr 2013 02:09 Post subject: |
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man im not too good with finances personally (not saying sauaje is or isn't) and until recently i had so many debts... just now im almost fully debt free and have a a bunch of money saved to buy my investment houses and stuff... but i still do not trust myself with credit cards...as sausje said when money is there, there is also an itch to spend it... on completely stupid shit... the crap i have bought out of the blue surprises even me.
its a shitty situation sausje is in and he is sort of stuck in a never-ending cycle in which he is unable to work and being unable to work he is stuck in need of help from government which helps him in limited ways (problems with university and studies) where he needs it the most...without the education and help to become independent he just becomes more dependent on the government and stagnant.
good luck there sunshine. i think concentrate on the studies part as hard as u can, becoming independent with money is also a good thing!
as per people who just bash... i understand the mentality of omg people leeching off the system blabla... but these programs are what sets us in the west apart from developing countries... to me its a sign of how we refuse to let people fall through the cracks, or at least try.
I hear this ALLLLLL the time about homeless people "omfg that guy looks healthy why doesn't he get a fucking job instead of leeching off society" but they have NEVER sat foot in a shelter. i talk, pickup and detain homeless people everyday... sometimes just to give em a hot ride somewhere, like a shelter in the dead of the winter....but shelters here are abysmal and depressing places where chances of violence and theft is always present. most homeless people have mental problems or problems with authority or both, and yet they are suppose to gather in these shelters which exasperates the problems. I personally if i was homeless i would prefer to sleep on the street. but without staying in a shelter in a consistent bases for 6 months, u cannot apply for most government issued IDs needed for someone to hire you. so now they are unable to get a job, and they are even more dependent on the government. Still though, our care of people, however flawed, is night and day different and better than what people experience in third world countries. All im saying is that unless you have lived through it or thoroughly investigated the situation you shouldn't be so quick to judge people.
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deelix
PDIP Member
Posts: 32062
Location: Norway
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| Posted: Fri, 5th Apr 2013 09:15 Post subject: |
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sausje
Banned
Posts: 17716
Location: Limboland, Netherlands
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| Posted: Tue, 9th Jul 2013 15:47 Post subject: |
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And once more, today i didn't receive my €40,-, so i mailed to him.
Got a mail back then he was already out of money.. 2-3 weeks before getting new one..
AT LEAST €120,- is short now..
Seriously, these people get payed €110,- each month to handle my finances, yet they fail to do so for fuck sake..
Oh btw, did i say that i payed off my debts with all the extra money i had? 
Had ~€2500,- debt, payed a total of ~€1700,- and cleared
Proud member of Frustrated Association of International Losers Failing Against the Gifted and Superior (F.A.I.L.F.A.G.S)
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Nalo
nothing
Posts: 13527
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| Posted: Tue, 9th Jul 2013 15:50 Post subject: |
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Last edited by Nalo on Wed, 3rd Jul 2024 06:26; edited 2 times in total
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| Posted: Tue, 9th Jul 2013 22:14 Post subject: |
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Damn. Your system really takes leeching on a whole new level.
I currently make 1000eur, and I worked in IT for 8 years to be making this figure.
If someone told me I could be making 1500eur on welfare, of course I'll quit my job FFS!
This is wrong on so many levels.
| Lutzifer wrote: | | and yes, mine is only average |
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spankie
VIP Member
Posts: 2958
Location: Belgium
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So damn glad iv got a job again now, just sucks it took so long... anyways, back then I found out its possible to survive on very little money. Of course there won't be much "living the good life" tho 
