I pred on steam, I hope it pops up early june due to I will be having surgery and this will put a smile on my face whilst I have the bedrest on my laptop
A release date was mentioned in one of the most recent interviews, but it was quickly deleted. It said "26th of June" I'm afraid, so I doubt this will get an early June release.
I *hope* I'm wrong though I want this as badly as you do -- but given that they just implemented a Matrix system and it pushed back the early release of the Editor Tools, I'm not even entirely sure they'll hit the June release date
well i consider it a nice warm up to the online one that is being done..and I know it's browser based and all that FTP gubbins but I still like the system and story line so I will be playing that as well.
You'll hear no complaints from me, even if it is "browser" based - it's still a full game that you can play entirely solo and without any kind of restraints. In the Shadowrun world. That's win.
Oh look, apologist cunts whining about "practicality" in a game about MAGIC and CYBERNETICS and DRAGONS and ORCS and ELVES and JACKING INTO THE MATRIX. I'm sick and tired of people defending the cuts and stripping in the game so far. I bought my copy over a year ago and even I can sit there and point out huge glaring faults with the game so far. Why do so many people have to be raging fanboys, utterly blind to any and every fault?
For some reason I have the feeling that Shadowrun: Returns will be a short, incomplete and shallow turn-based RPG. I hope I'm wrong about the game.
I'm inclined to agree with you... and it hurts like hell. I was talking to m3th0d about this last night and the sheer amount of features stripped or not present in the game is rather shocking. HBS regularly cite time and money as reasons for missing or non-implemented functionality surrounding the editor and the game itself, but come on! They want $400k and got 3x that amount, it's slightly worrisome to imagine what product would be available had they only hit their target.
Don't get me wrong, I'm super psyched for this (a proper Shadowrun? Yes please!) but to be honest, the more the developers have revealed gameplay and engine limitations/choices the less excited I've become It really does seem like SR will be a short and shallow RPG built around primarily being a toolset for others to make huge* games/Runs
*hopefully it offers the chance for huge Runs, as that "texture memory" gauge in the Quickstart vid looks frighteningly low.
It is a bit to early to be pessimistic. Don't forget this isn't a full priced game, but a low spec budget title. I've the game delivers good turnbased combat and a satisfying 15-20 hour campaign i'm happy, i can't recall a recent rpg for ages that delivered that.
It is a bit to early to be pessimistic. Don't forget this isn't a full priced game, but a low spec budget title. I've the game delivers good turnbased combat and a satisfying 15-20 hour campaign i'm happy, i can't recall a recent rpg for ages that delivered that.
Here comes the "it's cheap" argument again. I'm just going to leave this here, as is my legal right () as someone that has paid for the game;
Quote:
Turns out Shadowrun Returns doesn't allow you to save manually, instead it's using automated checkpoint saves because the developers claim they don't have the time or budget to create a standard saving system. I'm starting to become bitterly disappointed about this game, so many features either cut or not making it in the game at all, the dev team just keep saying "we're a small team and on a tight budget" -- the fuck? Considering they got THREE TIMES the money they wanted (they wanted $400k and ended up being $1.2m) I'm positively terrified at what would have been produced had they only met their required target. From what it seems, this could have been an RPGMaker 2003 title, ffs. The extra $800,000 has gone on art
*No Matrix. Decking is worthless, if it exists at all, without the ability to use the Matrix.
*No Astral. Mages are worthless except for glass cannons, with no ability to sense presence or danger.
*No classes. One-size-fits-all mentality, spend karma to gain abilities.
*Enemies vanish the instant you kill them. No persistent bodies. *No loot system, no looting environment *or* enemies.
*Limited-to-no inventory system. Doesn't look like there's even a paper-doll for equipment.
*Click>Destination automatic move system, no free move.
*One city, Seattle, with Berlin to come as DLC later (about the only good news is that this is free to KS backers)
*Automated checkpoint saves at the start of a Run and the end of it. Not inbetween and no manual saving.
*No Lifestyles (home/base system)
*Can't create other characters than main character. All hirelings are pre-generated.
*No Contracts or Hireling permanence, you choose new Runners for each mission.
*No custom portraits. Can't create or import them.
*No custom music. Can't import for player-made Runs, everything has to be used from the shipped-data pool.
*No modding support outside of the toolset, which means if the Run-creator/editor set can't do it - you can't do it.
*No importing tilesets/graphics. All you can use is what's available for Seattle.
*Infinite ammo for all Runners, no separate ammo types.
*No dual-wielding, either melee *or* firearms.
*Turn-based fighting system with no way of speeding up or slowing down combat as there's "not enough funds" apparently.[/b]
*No interactive city map.
*Objective markers + compass with no way of disabling (this one I'm not so fussed about, objective markers are fine by me)
The more I read about the game, the more disappointed I get. I've wanted something like for years, ever since the SNES/Megadrive versions, but both of those games seem to pack significantly more complexity and features. It really does seem like the budget went on creating an RPGMaker-style trigger-based toolset and some pretty visuals. So fucking depressing
The only change above from when I posted those thoughts back at the start of April after their "no manual saving, only checkpoints" bombshell (it costs too much money!! We don't have time!!1111) is that now a rudimentary Matrix system has been implemented and you can now import custom portraits. If you think all that means it's still "too early to be pessimistic" -- well... we all have our opinions. I'm still looking forward to the game, but with vastly reduced optimism.
No no, it wasn't planned originally - these are just things that, across the KS and forum, people asked about and were told "no" --- a lot of that above ^^ are all part of the PnP Shadowrun experience, which is what Gitelman and Weisman were touting SR:R as being close to. I guess you could blame that on people's expectations, but still..... all that not being part of the final game? That sucks. Especially the editor limitations. When I mention the money it's basically because they wanted to make a game for 400k, then ended up getting three times that amount and STILL haven't implemented all those above.
It just makes me wonder what kind of game would have been made at 400k, if SR:R today is what cost 1.2m.
Still, it's shipping with the editor (supposedly due for release soon to backers at a certain tier level) and it also comes with Steam Workshop support - so hopefully a lot of what many of us perceive to be missing, can be modded in later
Last edited by sabin1981 on Mon, 3rd Jun 2013 20:50; edited 1 time in total
sabin: Are there any official forum threads in which the devs are communicating about these terrible decisions?
Suddenly I'm glad I didn't waste a dime on a kickstarter.
Aye mate, the main forum and the KS status comments -- the specific SR:R forum is offline at the moment due to a permissions error, likely due to to the eminent release of the "backer-only" early Editor release. Everyone else gets the Editor when the game ships.
The entire Shadowrun Returns forum section is missing and if you have any direct links to a thread you'll get a permissions error on trying to view it (Google Cache helps though)
It's "unofficial" *but* compiled by a community moderator that has gathered all information (and sourced) from developers that post on Shadowrun.com and Kickstarter.
There's several items on that list really kill my enthusiasm for this game:
- No classes -> lacks replay value
- No loot system -> that seriously seriously sucks.
- Limited-to-no inventory system -> this really sucks as well.
- Only checkpoints -> first RPG EVER that I recall only using checkpoints.
So basically, it's a linear game with no loot, non-existent inventory and basically fuck all depth? Seriously? Is this COD in third person?
People are arguing, rightly or wrongly, that "looting" isn't part of the Shadowrun ethos because you're not there to rummage through people's pockets after you kill them, that Shadowrunners will already have the best kit they can afford because that's the difference between life and death. I get that, I do! As a lore-standpoint I really do get that, but it looks like it can make for a dull RPG experience. Buy your kit, hire new Runners each time (that particular bit grates on me, no more Contracts ), go and kill a bunch of guards, get out. Rinse repeat.
Oh well, we'll just have to see when it launches. I hope I'm wrong, I'll be overjoyed to say "Heyyyyyy, I was SO fucking wrong it's hilarious!" -- because if being wrong about my fears means we'll get a fantastic game, then fuck it... I'll be only too happy.
Though in regards to looting, if you kill other runners and take their gear you can get even better stuff for yourself or make a profit selling them, no?
Though in regards to looting, if you kill other runners and take their gear you can get even better stuff for yourself or make a profit selling them, no?
That's my standpoint too. Steal someone else's goods, fence them, spend the nuyen on new gear! At least the devs have stated that while looting isn't part of the game, Run creators using the editor *can* specify items/etc to drop from killed foes if they trigger for it -- the functionality just won't be in the base campaigns other than plot-specific stuff, like keys.
~edit~
Sorry guys, I don't mean to be so horribly negative. It's just disappointment, yanno?
Wait, it doesn't have classes? The fuck? Wasn't there some artice in GameInformer specifically about classes like Street Samurai etc.? *confused*
It's right at the start of the video. They say that there are several starting character archetypes but you can develop your character freely - it's a classless system.
Sorry guys, I don't mean to be so horribly negative. It's just disappointment, yanno?
I understand, you end up disappointed in the comparison with the original game. I'm good to go as I never played the console classic back in the 90's, and I'm really loving what I'm seeing so far
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I want this as badly as you do -- but given that they just implemented a Matrix system and it pushed back the early release of the Editor Tools, I'm not even entirely sure they'll hit the June release date 
I'm sick and tired of people defending the cuts and stripping in the game so far. I bought my copy over a year ago and even I can sit there and point out huge glaring faults with the game so far. Why do so many people have to be raging fanboys, utterly blind to any and every fault?
) as someone that has paid for the game;
