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ixigia
[Moderator] Consigliere
Posts: 65099
Location: Italy
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 Posted: Thu, 22nd Aug 2013 23:35 Post subject: |
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| 4treyu wrote: | Well, it's not too often that I find myself disagreeing with you ixigia, but it seems this is one of those few situations. Even when I agree with some of the problems you mention (like the awful loss of personality of Sam), or in some degree lost of "precision" as you call it, even though so far I've only seen that when trying to hide knocked-out enemies. But many others I have to completely disagree or at least disagree with the magnitude you're attributing to them. For instance:
"The game strongly encourages the (ab)use of the quick press-space-to-cover system"
Not at all. I'm not even using that "feature", same goes with wallhanging, I'm using slow-pace only for those, as not to break the immersion. And the game doesn't force you at all to use it in any situation.
"with tons of unnecessary visceral cutscenes"
What? I'm gonna need you confirm to me that you completely despised Max Payne 3 then, cause that game had at least triple the amount (I'm being conservative there) of cutscenes this one has. Like I already mentioned, I find the amount of cutscenes is minimal inside missions, and when out of them, Paladin etc. they're brief enough to fulfill their informative role in the main story, sure a couple of bad jokes from that lame Charlie character, might get a bit excessive the more the game progresses, but they still keep them quick as he instantly receives the "you're a dork" look from Grim, Sam and Briggs.
"It's 30% Sam, 30% Future Soldier and 40% Ezio"
Are you truly playing on Perfectionist? Ghost style? Come on man! Future Soldier? really? Tell me you had a very bad day, doesn't sound like you, really! 
And finally, so far the game, with the several annoyances it certainly has, does feel like Splinter Cell to me. And I played the trilogy only like 2 months ago! And one of those games is on my top 10 list!. This one is certainly not at its level, and you could call it an unwarranted "evolution", but it's still a pretty good game, offering a shitload of options and alternatives. Up until this week, I was very fearful this would be like Hitman Absolution all over again, but in the end turned out it's not! they found a satisfying, albeit far from perfect, balance between old school gameplay, and cater-to-the-derps gameplay, and I would be very unfair not to admit it.
Now, peace out |
How dare you! 
Haha jokes aside (and sorry for the late reply but working full day sucks), perhaps I sounded too harsh with the analogies and critics, but even if the improvements have been enormous if compared to that abomination called Conviction, there are several unpleasant aspects here that I cannot unsee, not even when I play on perfectionist.
It's undeniable for me that the game encourages the player to use the cover system, since many times even if you're behind a block in the classic pose, perfectly repairing yourself, the AI spots you anyway since it's way more reactive than in the past..(good) and it often ends up being unrealistically accurate, in an Absolution-purist-way (bad). The cover-to-cover which magically guarantees you to stay undetected is the aspect that reminds me of Future Soldier the most (I wasn't talking about the style of play), along with the forced action sequences, drones or the "shooting from above" in the 2nd mission.
As for the cutscenes, I somewhat tolerated them in MP3 since they were coherent and the story was captivating, but here, in a SC game...sadly I can't say the same. The dialogues are pretty banal and the new characters seem coming from a cheap action movie :/
(It was the same in AC3 (Desmond parts) for me where every time there was a cutscene I cringed inside). The few invisible 'guided cinematic handholding' sequences a-la nu-Tomb Raider -aka hidden cutscenes- also I didn't like.
Speaking of Assassin's Creed (especially the 3rd one), I found the resemblance striking when it comes to some of the basic movements, only speeded up more, not to mention fast semiautomatic climbing and hanging which are just ugly to watch and you often can't really avoid them if you're looking for a way to circumvent the enemies in Ghost_mode. Fucks sake not even a panther can do that, and Sam is supposed to be a pensioner  
Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying it's a terrible game. Levels are fairly "complex" and it's definitely true that you can simply not kill anyone and get away with it, but despite the improvements, Sam's gotten that arcadey run-of-the-mill feel typical of mainstream gamepad-friendly games that I despise. 
I guess we'll have to agree to disagree.  |
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| Posted: Thu, 22nd Aug 2013 23:39 Post subject: |
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I played some SvM and it's pretty damn fun... and hard! I really love asymmetric multiplayer modes! As for getting into matches... yeah, it's a bit messed up. Ubisoft doesn't seem to know much about match-making. The game kept throwing me into the same damn lobby which wouldn't start because something bugged and then there weren't enough players. Then I alt-tabbed and it crashed, hehe...
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| Posted: Thu, 22nd Aug 2013 23:41 Post subject: |
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| Quote: | | which magically guarantees you to stay undetected |
Not true. Not on perfectionist at least. I've had guards see me if I didn't time my move right or if someone happened to be looking right at me. And they weren't in a higher state of alert at that point.
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| Posted: Thu, 22nd Aug 2013 23:57 Post subject: |
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I figured out why the game stutters, its the filter keys of windows, wow, if i plug in a game pad it is completely stutter free..tried turning on the filter key strokes but no dice..
RYZEN 3700X | RTX 2070 SUPER
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| Posted: Fri, 23rd Aug 2013 00:29 Post subject: |
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Really liked the SvM classic mode. It's way more fun then SCDA and not so "derped" as I anticipated. And most of the maps have really good atmosphere, making them fun to play, but the design of some is lacking, like the objectives are in a straight line on the same ground level. No cheap tricks like wall hacks, outlined motion detectors and full range "presence sensor". Having ore then one gadget at a time is also nice, but it could use just a bit of variety.
Defensively not even near as good as CT, but given that it's the closest thing we will get, i'll waste good chunk of hours with it.
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ixigia
[Moderator] Consigliere
Posts: 65099
Location: Italy
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| Posted: Fri, 23rd Aug 2013 00:39 Post subject: |
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| dodger2020 wrote: | | Quote: | | which magically guarantees you to stay undetected |
Not true. Not on perfectionist at least. I've had guards see me if I didn't time my move right or if someone happened to be looking right at me. And they weren't in a higher state of alert at that point. |
Yeah, if you're too close to them they spot you, it's inevitable. But what I was trying to say is, using the quick cover-to-cover often gives you a great advantage since it reduces the time that you stay exposed, because of Sam moving at warp speed. |
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LeoNatan
☢ NFOHump Despot ☢
Posts: 73255
Location: Ramat HaSharon, Israel 🇮🇱
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| Posted: Fri, 23rd Aug 2013 01:20 Post subject: |
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Cool game 
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ClaudeFTW
Posts: 5074
Location: Bucharest, Romania
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| Posted: Fri, 23rd Aug 2013 01:59 Post subject: |
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| LeoNatan wrote: | | Cool game |
Not sure if sarcasm, irony or baiting.
R7 2700x @4GHz / MSI B450 Tomahawk / beQuiet! Dark Rock 4 / 32GB @3000 MHz / MSI RTX 2060 Gaming Z / Samsung 850 EVO 250GB / Western Digital 1TB / Fractal Design Meshify C Dark / SuperFlower Leadex Gold 650W / DELL whatever 27 inch IPS
I usually stream stuff: http://www.twitch.tv/claudeftw |
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LeoNatan
☢ NFOHump Despot ☢
Posts: 73255
Location: Ramat HaSharon, Israel 🇮🇱
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| Posted: Fri, 23rd Aug 2013 02:26 Post subject: |
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BTW, I think people forget that the original games also had cover mode, and was also required to not get seen when near a wall or an obstacle. And going from cover to cover definitely does not guarantee anything, and me and Neon have the number of retries to prove it.
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| Posted: Fri, 23rd Aug 2013 03:24 Post subject: |
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Do 4th Echelon Missions affect the main story/campaign in any way? Can you play them after you finish the main story line?
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| Posted: Fri, 23rd Aug 2013 03:34 Post subject: |
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| H4wkeye wrote: | | Do 4th Echelon Missions affect the main story/campaign in any way? Can you play them after you finish the main story line? |
I would also like to know this, can you play the campaign, and do the side missions after? or in the middle of it? Or do they expire at some point? (I mean all of the 10 solo side missions)
RYZEN 3700X | RTX 2070 SUPER
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Neon
VIP Member
Posts: 18935
Location: Poland
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| Posted: Fri, 23rd Aug 2013 03:39 Post subject: |
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| Posted: Fri, 23rd Aug 2013 03:51 Post subject: |
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| Posted: Fri, 23rd Aug 2013 04:04 Post subject: |
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| Posted: Fri, 23rd Aug 2013 04:06 Post subject: |
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Last edited by Interinactive on Tue, 5th Oct 2021 03:05; edited 1 time in total
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Neon
VIP Member
Posts: 18935
Location: Poland
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| Posted: Fri, 23rd Aug 2013 04:55 Post subject: |
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Last edited by Interinactive on Tue, 5th Oct 2021 03:05; edited 1 time in total
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ixigia
[Moderator] Consigliere
Posts: 65099
Location: Italy
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| Posted: Fri, 23rd Aug 2013 05:56 Post subject: |
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| 4treyu wrote: | I didn't expect less of Neon, our elite stealth player (frolsa seems to be another ace in that deparment too) 
@ixigia sorry man I think we're just gonna have to agree to disagree (like you already said) for our own sake only thing I can agree about your reply is that the cover-to-cover mechanics are stupid and look ridiculous, just like the panther moves. But they're not forced on you, and I'm not using any of those at all. And I'm playing on Perfectionist aiming for complete ghost missions, leaving most AI undisturbed.
This game really succeeded at giving you choices, it's not perfect and it got room for improvement for a possible sequel. But it's already a great effort and pretty good and balanced |
*back from another session*
It's hard to not use all them panther moves since they simplify the game and aren't just features that you can turn on/off, same for the whiste while on cover->E button, but I'm trying to avoid them at all costs and things are getting tolerable now.
I'd say in order to have a rewarding stealth experience in the game you have to force yourself into not using exploits (and this SC has tons of them even on perfectionist, IMO ), but thankfully the level design is actually good so you get the chance to be sneaky.
Now if only there was a "slower Sam" mod it would be even better |
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| Posted: Fri, 23rd Aug 2013 06:03 Post subject: |
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Last edited by Interinactive on Tue, 5th Oct 2021 03:05; edited 1 time in total
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| Posted: Fri, 23rd Aug 2013 06:07 Post subject: |
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The difference is that in Absolution the difficulty of staying undetected resided in the fact that the AI logic was badly designed (that in conjunction with the flawed disguise system and the existence of instinct). In this game it's the opposite.
But I get your point that the number of retries isn't proof enough, just part of it.
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| Posted: Fri, 23rd Aug 2013 06:11 Post subject: |
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Last edited by Interinactive on Tue, 5th Oct 2021 03:05; edited 1 time in total
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| Posted: Fri, 23rd Aug 2013 06:32 Post subject: |
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Beat it earlier today. I mostly enjoyed it but there was too much focus on action in some parts, especially those ridiculous 1st person sequences with Briggs.
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| Posted: Fri, 23rd Aug 2013 06:54 Post subject: |
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Last edited by Interinactive on Tue, 5th Oct 2021 03:05; edited 2 times in total
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| Posted: Fri, 23rd Aug 2013 07:35 Post subject: |
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| Posted: Fri, 23rd Aug 2013 07:44 Post subject: |
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Last edited by Interinactive on Tue, 5th Oct 2021 03:05; edited 1 time in total
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