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crossmr
Posts: 2966
Location: United Kingdom
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 Posted: Mon, 20th Apr 2015 16:06 Post subject: Why are devs so fucking lazy? |
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For those who are old enough. I want you to think back to BBS door games.
These were pretty much the pre-cursors to modern multiplayer games. One of my favorite was Land of Devastation. In this game you had to save the world. You wandered around the wasteland, in a real map. You could fight monsters, pick up gear, improve your character, trade and sell, craft some stuff, upgrade equipment, build forts, take over areas with automated weapons. You had to collect pieces of a machine that would save the world. There were all kinds of terrains, obstacles, areas, and you could even, as the sysop, edit the map to be whatever you wanted, easily add your own monsters, equipment, etc.
Now, we have facebook games which are the equivalent of door games and the best they can do is, click on this, come back in 8 minutes and click on it again. After you clicked that a few times, click this other one.
Would it really be so hard to make a quality game in this day and age? given that 30 years ago they could make that.
intel ultra 7 265k, 64gb ram, 3070
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| Posted: Mon, 20th Apr 2015 16:12 Post subject: |
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| Quote: | | Why are devs so fucking lazy? |
Because they can (be lazy)? Why waste your time and resources if there are enough fools who buy these games anyway?
1) Lenovo Legion 7 (AMD Ryzen 7 5800H, RTX 3080 16Gb, 32Gb DDR4, SSD 1TB +2TB
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| Posted: Mon, 20th Apr 2015 16:19 Post subject: |
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In the BBS era, games were created by gamers for similarly minded gamers. Pretty much geeks creating games they would like to play with their geek friends. It wasn't about making money.
Today it's mostly about making the most money the fastest way. You really think anyone of the facebook developers play their own games?
i7 6700k @ 4.4 GHZ, 2060s, 16 GB RAM, SSD, Windows 10x64.
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| Posted: Mon, 20th Apr 2015 16:20 Post subject: |
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| Posted: Mon, 20th Apr 2015 16:21 Post subject: |
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Why would they spend time doing a fine game when they can do a shitty buggy game with dlc and sell millions of it?
It's the gamers that made the devs lazy, by buying all the shit they throw at us
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Przepraszam
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Posts: 14497
Location: Poland. New York.
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| Posted: Mon, 20th Apr 2015 16:22 Post subject: |
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Because fuck you give me money.
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| Posted: Mon, 20th Apr 2015 16:26 Post subject: |
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have one look at steam and what sells, and in what quantities and you got your answer.
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| Posted: Mon, 20th Apr 2015 16:53 Post subject: Re: Why are devs so fucking lazy? |
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| crossmr wrote: | For those who are old enough. I want you to think back to BBS door games.
These were pretty much the pre-cursors to modern multiplayer games. One of my favorite was Land of Devastation. In this game you had to save the world. You wandered around the wasteland, in a real map. You could fight monsters, pick up gear, improve your character, trade and sell, craft some stuff, upgrade equipment, build forts, take over areas with automated weapons. You had to collect pieces of a machine that would save the world. There were all kinds of terrains, obstacles, areas, and you could even, as the sysop, edit the map to be whatever you wanted, easily add your own monsters, equipment, etc.
Now, we have facebook games which are the equivalent of door games and the best they can do is, click on this, come back in 8 minutes and click on it again. After you clicked that a few times, click this other one.
Would it really be so hard to make a quality game in this day and age? given that 30 years ago they could make that. |
Completely different audiences.
BBS games were made for hardcore geeks who at the time were basically the only ones who used BBSes.
Facebook games are made for bored housewives, underage kids and generic "non-gamer" audiences. Obviously they're gonna have the most basic and simplified gameplay possible.
Bottom line: devs didn't get lazy, it's just that the "population" of the internet is not made of geeks and hardcore gamers anymore.
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| Posted: Mon, 20th Apr 2015 16:53 Post subject: |
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They are not lazy, developing a good looking game isn't easy either. It's just that the focus has shifted. The people that enjoyed those hardcore games are still around and if they look around, they'll still find good & new games to play (Pillars of Eternity). And even at that times not all games were deep or complex, so stop glorifying the past. There are still lots of gems to discover. If you only care about AAA titles, they were always a bit derpy, or stupid facebook games whatever.
Plus it's not even the devs fault. They just develop what the people with money tell them to develop. Indie developers who fund themselves still create wonderful gems from time to time 
Ninja'd by the_leaf 
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| Posted: Mon, 20th Apr 2015 17:40 Post subject: |
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| Posted: Mon, 20th Apr 2015 17:41 Post subject: |
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DXWarlock
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Posts: 11422
Location: Florida, USA
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| Posted: Mon, 20th Apr 2015 18:03 Post subject: |
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I second what Leaf and Pumpy said.
The target audience of the internet 'door' games is totally different.
Door (facebook/app) games now are not about depth, but quick in and out sessions that are more distractions than a hobby/pasttime.
Back when I ran a BBS, all my members was PC geeks. The few and far between of the population that liked the sound of a dial up modem, liked the challenge of setting IRQs by hand and knew exactly what was in their computer. They enjoyed spending hours and hours a day calling BBS's and playing games, looking around, and such.
Computers WAS their hobby and past time. They needed complex, in depth games to entertain them as that was their main source of entertainment usually. Spending 30 minutes setting up a game for MP over the modem, telling people to not pick up the phone for the next 2 hours was no big deal to go thru, as they would play all day.
Not many like us around anymore. Even most people that say "Oh gaming is my hobby" now a days considers sitting on a console for 3 hours or playing WoW/whatever for 5 hours on Saturday as "hardcore".
Now the focus is in making games you can play with one hand while cooking, or "oh I'll play a game of candy crush while waiting for the bus".
Plus the devs are totally different. There is many that are making games because they love to like the old days. But many are also making them for the profit. For everyone making a game because its their passion, another is making a game with the idea of "whats the best idea for a big appeal to get customers"
-We don't control what happens to us in life, but we control how we respond to what happens in life.
-Hard times create strong men, strong men create good times, good times create weak men, and weak men create hard times. -G. Michael Hopf
Disclaimer: Post made by me are of my own creation. A delusional mind relayed in text form.
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| Posted: Mon, 20th Apr 2015 18:27 Post subject: |
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I don't know what door games are but if indie devs haven't made any in recent years (I assume they would not be expensive to make) then they must be really unpopular. There's your answer OP.
TWIN PEAKS is "something of a miracle."
"...like nothing else on television."
"a phenomenon."
"A tangled tale of sex, violence, power, junk food..."
"Like Nothing On Earth"
~ WHAT THEY'RE TRYING TO SAY CAN ONLY BE SEEN ~
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CHTUOgYNRzY
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| Posted: Mon, 20th Apr 2015 21:58 Post subject: |
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| consolitis wrote: | | I don't know what door games are but if indie devs haven't made any in recent years (I assume they would not be expensive to make) then they must be really unpopular. There's your answer OP. |
+1
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(Nexus)
Posts: 2807
Location: 192.168.1.72
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| Posted: Mon, 20th Apr 2015 22:22 Post subject: |
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| h0rnyfavn wrote: | | Quote: | | Why are devs so fucking lazy? |
Because they can (be lazy)? Why waste your time and resources if there are enough fools who buy these games anyway? |
Just what he said, to many idiots pay for crappy games...why put effort in something if people buy it anyway ?
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DXWarlock
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Posts: 11422
Location: Florida, USA
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| Posted: Mon, 20th Apr 2015 22:32 Post subject: |
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| consolitis wrote: | | I don't know what door games are but if indie devs haven't made any in recent years (I assume they would not be expensive to make) then they must be really unpopular. There's your answer OP. |
They haven't made them because BBS's aren't around anymore. A door game was what the type of install on a BBS it was, not the type of gamestyle itself. Think of "door" in a bbs like "app" on a phone of sorts. You had turn based games, strategy games, RPG games, story based games, etc just like now a days.
It would be like saying they don't make good RPG games, because using DOS isn't really popular. While hes complaining about the quality of the social hub games, not the platform its on.
Think of dwarf fortress, its comparable to a BBS game of sorts on look and style. The graphics are ANSI based, its menu is text based, but a really in depth complex, intricate game.
And now that facebook is the BBS's of today: a place to login talk to people, post random stuff to friends, read post of others and such, the games didnt evolve with it. candy crush/farmville/Forge of empires is crap.
-We don't control what happens to us in life, but we control how we respond to what happens in life.
-Hard times create strong men, strong men create good times, good times create weak men, and weak men create hard times. -G. Michael Hopf
Disclaimer: Post made by me are of my own creation. A delusional mind relayed in text form.
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| Posted: Mon, 20th Apr 2015 22:57 Post subject: |
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Ah, ok, thanks, so that's what a door game is.
So the question is "Why are Facebook games so simple when they could be so much more?" I can't say I care either way as I don't use fb.
TWIN PEAKS is "something of a miracle."
"...like nothing else on television."
"a phenomenon."
"A tangled tale of sex, violence, power, junk food..."
"Like Nothing On Earth"
~ WHAT THEY'RE TRYING TO SAY CAN ONLY BE SEEN ~
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CHTUOgYNRzY
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| Posted: Tue, 21st Apr 2015 02:44 Post subject: |
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What a silly question.
The devs are not lazy, they are after the money.
The success story of capitalism is to provide dumb masses with cheap, low quality crap while getting the highest profit margin possible. Apple is a prime example of this. Ikea. Mc Donalds junk food. Or Facebook games.
You have to target morons, because they are the most plentiful group. That's why democracy works better than the toughest tyranny - through the miracle of the millions of gullible and easily manipulated morons. Just hire a few trendsetters, tweet away and you are golden.
Nobody will develop a super-complex, deep games that take ages to produce and only a handful of people will persist through the learning cliff to actually play them - well nobody except Tarn Adams, perhaps.
Morons + crap = money!
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| Posted: Tue, 21st Apr 2015 03:18 Post subject: |
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I've found running Linux is filtering out all the derpy games for me, virtually all games I'm interested are now ported, the classics run really well with dosbox or wine. I'm stretched to find anything Win only I want to play, but I'm not into a lot AAA games you guys like.
.. Awaiting the win, nvid, Intel fanboy assualt.
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Morphineus
VIP Member
Posts: 24883
Location: Sweden
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| Posted: Tue, 21st Apr 2015 03:57 Post subject: |
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Meh... it's as tiresome as the unix superiority complex so you won't get it from me. 
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crossmr
Posts: 2966
Location: United Kingdom
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| Posted: Tue, 21st Apr 2015 12:22 Post subject: |
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While there is some logic behind catering to the lowest common denominator, if that was all every single developer out there was interested in, you wouldn't see 10% of the stuff out there that you see now. Indie devs would never be out making anything remotely interesting, as derivative as they are now. I just find it hard to believe that with all the different devs out there, especially ones interested in mobile and facebook that we haven't gotten anything more palatable after all this time. There were some weird shitty door games too. Some of them were derivative, legend of the red dragon ripoffs, but there was a lot of stuff that was a fuck ton more innovative than what we have today.
intel ultra 7 265k, 64gb ram, 3070
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