I was disappointed by the first one, so put me in the "meh" column
I'm of the same sentiment. Tyranny was great, but PoE was ruined by the shitty combat implementation and hundreds of unnecessary "backer characters" littering every town. I'm betting on more of the same.
I can never be free, because the shackles I wear can't be touched or be seen.
i9-9900k, MSI MPG-Z390 Gaming Pro Carbon, 32GB DDR4 @ 3000, eVGA GTX 1080 DT, Samsung 970 EVO Plus nVME 1TB
I was disappointed by the first one, so put me in the "meh" column
I'm of the same sentiment. Tyranny was great, but PoE was ruined by the shitty combat implementation and hundreds of unnecessary "backer characters" littering every town. I'm betting on more of the same.
The backer characters pissed me off. Not only did their very existence break immersion, there were far too many of them and it kept distracting me. I believe there's a mod that removes them?
I'm of the same sentiment. Tyranny was great, but PoE was ruined by the shitty combat implementation and hundreds of unnecessary "backer characters" littering every town. I'm betting on more of the same.
The backer characters pissed me off. Not only did their very existence break immersion, there were far too many of them and it kept distracting me. I believe there's a mod that removes them?
TBH i never really found the backer characters annoying our being out of place.
Also the combat was more than fine to me.
What annoyed me though, was the very slow story telling, with barely any real ups or downs to it.
Enthoo Evolv ATX TG // Asus Prime x370 // Ryzen 1700 // Gainward GTX 1080 // 16GB DDR4-3200
I don't think it will reach 4.4-5 millions. The goals over 2 millions haven't been so interesting and I doubt this campaign will go past 3-3.5.
The Companion relationships is something that been asked since the first game,I hope it won't slow down too much now,we need to get momentum to pass the 3M and more!
I don't think it will reach 4.4-5 millions. The goals over 2 millions haven't been so interesting and I doubt this campaign will go past 3-3.5.
The Companion relationships is something that been asked since the first game,I hope it won't slow down too much now,we need to get momentum to pass the 3M and more!
It will most likely slow down the development process, unless Obsidian started to implement this feature before the KS campaign and now they use it as a way to attract people into funding or maybe it will be a cheap implementation.
I just wish they would hire some dude who didn't overthink and overbalance the mechanics.
Someone with a strong instinct for entertaining gameplay - instead of Sawyer who seems to design his mechanics with a focus on being as anti-D&D as possible, instead of understanding the appeal of D&D mechanics and actually improving upon them.
No, I don't, actually, but that really depends on which iteration of DnD we're talking about. I do think it's much better than the old AD&D combat, but I don't think it's completely up there with 3rd (or rather 3.5, since it was a lot more refined) edition's diversity and flow yet, even though certain refinements I do enjoy a lot. I like the engagment system (but it does need some work still), I like restricting rest cheese, I like the wizard's more flexible spell system (pretty much copied over from 5th edition), even though spell lists still need some work. I also like having more active abilities for different characters, even though it makes the game harder to manage. And PoE's more diversified class design (different resources, mechanics etc.) is cool too.
As far as direct comparisions go, I do prefer PoE's combat over BG. NWN2 would be a bit more complicated case - I think I prefer the combat itself (because of reasons already mentioned), but NWN2 still has the upper hand in some areas (like character development - PoE's was still too limited). ToEE is a different beast altogether. I'm not huge on TB combat in RPGs (strategy games are a different discussion - they need specific setups for it to work) - I feel the turtle pace of even basic encounters takes me away from aspects I actually enjoy more in these games, while offering nothing of note in return. I also usually don't feel any tension whatsoever while playing such games - everything is so cool, clean, totally controlled and chess-like it doesn't really seem like combat. ToEE was actually decent - one of very few TB systems I enjoyed (alongside D:OS) but it's still below even BG for me personally, despite being more mechanically complex. I actually never finished ToEE either - got bored when my characters hit level cap halfway through the dungeon.
I'm really low on cash, but now that Obsidian lost the big bucks coming from Armored Warfare, I'm going to pledge as well. They might have disappointed me lately, but I wouldn't want to see this studio die.
I'm really low on cash, but now that Obsidian lost the big bucks coming from Armored Warfare, I'm going to pledge as well. They might have disappointed me lately, but I wouldn't want to see this studio die.
You wanna see them reach 3 mil for some hot bisexual companion relationship?
Enthoo Evolv ATX TG // Asus Prime x370 // Ryzen 1700 // Gainward GTX 1080 // 16GB DDR4-3200
They might have disappointed me lately, but I wouldn't want to see this studio die.
I don't want to see them die either, but I refuse to support the scheme that is Fig.
I can never be free, because the shackles I wear can't be touched or be seen.
i9-9900k, MSI MPG-Z390 Gaming Pro Carbon, 32GB DDR4 @ 3000, eVGA GTX 1080 DT, Samsung 970 EVO Plus nVME 1TB
I'm really low on cash, but now that Obsidian lost the big bucks coming from Armored Warfare, I'm going to pledge as well. They might have disappointed me lately, but I wouldn't want to see this studio die.
You wanna see them reach 3 mil for some hot bisexual companion relationship?
It's a cheaper way to get the game (25$) and a way to support Obsidian in what could be some tougher times for the studio.
Immunity wrote:
Nodrim wrote:
They might have disappointed me lately, but I wouldn't want to see this studio die.
I don't want to see them die either, but I refuse to support the scheme that is Fig.
Fig investment program is bullshit, but you have the option for a normal pledge.
No, I don't, actually, but that really depends on which iteration of DnD we're talking about. I do think it's much better than the old AD&D combat, but I don't think it's completely up there with 3rd (or rather 3.5, since it was a lot more refined) edition's diversity and flow yet, even though certain refinements I do enjoy a lot. I like the engagment system (but it does need some work still), I like restricting rest cheese, I like the wizard's more flexible spell system (pretty much copied over from 5th edition), even though spell lists still need some work. I also like having more active abilities for different characters, even though it makes the game harder to manage. And PoE's more diversified class design (different resources, mechanics etc.) is cool too.
As far as direct comparisions go, I do prefer PoE's combat over BG. NWN2 would be a bit more complicated case - I think I prefer the combat itself (because of reasons already mentioned), but NWN2 still has the upper hand in some areas (like character development - PoE's was still too limited). ToEE is a different beast altogether. I'm not huge on TB combat in RPGs (strategy games are a different discussion - they need specific setups for it to work) - I feel the turtle pace of even basic encounters takes me away from aspects I actually enjoy more in these games, while offering nothing of note in return. I also usually don't feel any tension whatsoever while playing such games - everything is so cool, clean, totally controlled and chess-like it doesn't really seem like combat. ToEE was actually decent - one of very few TB systems I enjoyed (alongside D:OS) but it's still below even BG for me personally, despite being more mechanically complex. I actually never finished ToEE either - got bored when my characters hit level cap halfway through the dungeon.
TOEE still has one of the best turn based systems around, but game really wasn't even halfway done. AI was underdeveloped, it didn't use abilities at the fullest, engagements were poorly placed, so it the end system didn't matter and whole combat package wasn't interesting. For me Divinity is exact opposite. System is basic, fairly easy to exploit, but things that were broken in TOEE are working here. It's polished, challenging if you don't exploit things, and AI is good. Despite that, I'm not enjoying myself with Divinity, it's all just too basic. Cooldowns and completely unrestricted classes, are not something that I enjoy. One playthrough and it's shelved, at the same time I went trough POE three times already.
No, I don't, actually, but that really depends on which iteration of DnD we're talking about. I do think it's much better than the old AD&D combat, but I don't think it's completely up there with 3rd (or rather 3.5, since it was a lot more refined) edition's diversity and flow yet, even though certain refinements I do enjoy a lot. I like the engagment system (but it does need some work still), I like restricting rest cheese, I like the wizard's more flexible spell system (pretty much copied over from 5th edition), even though spell lists still need some work. I also like having more active abilities for different characters, even though it makes the game harder to manage. And PoE's more diversified class design (different resources, mechanics etc.) is cool too.
Fair enough. I think the new spell system is terrible - but that's mostly because of the rigid range limitations and the feeling of "unified" effects - where the nuances of each spell seems lost in the chaos of combat. Overall, the visual feedback and sound effects in PoE are very weak from a playability standpoint.
Then again, I don't think Obsidian are suited for subtle gameplay design. They simply don't have much talent beyond their approach to writing and C&C. Sometimes their mechanics are pretty good - but it's mostly because everything they do is old-school for the sake of it - and old-school will always appeal to me, because I'm, well, old-school.
But it never seemed to me they understand WHY old-school is great. They're just profiting from being one of the very, very few developers who directly appeal to the minority fanbase of old-school design.
The concept of the engagement system is good - and is used to great effect in other tactical games - but the execution of it is a mess in PoE because of the awkward placement restrictions and downright moronic combat AI, especially when it comes to movement in tight quarters like the many, many dungeons in the game.
With 6 players in your party - combat becomes micromanagment hell in a dungeon, and not because of any kind of tactical challenge, but because of super basic stuff like putting the tanks in the right place and avoiding attacks of opportunity.
Ridiculously poorly done in PoE, I'm sorry to say.
Again, they understand good concepts - they just can't implement them to save their lives. It's like they've never really played their own games - they just sit on some pedestal and design them.
Naturally, if you play on easy mode - or you actually enjoy micromanaging basic movement for all characters in combat, it's another story.
Quote:
As far as direct comparisions go, I do prefer PoE's combat over BG. NWN2 would be a bit more complicated case - I think I prefer the combat itself (because of reasons already mentioned), but NWN2 still has the upper hand in some areas (like character development - PoE's was still too limited). ToEE is a different beast altogether. I'm not huge on TB combat in RPGs (strategy games are a different discussion - they need specific setups for it to work) - I feel the turtle pace of even basic encounters takes me away from aspects I actually enjoy more in these games, while offering nothing of note in return. I also usually don't feel any tension whatsoever while playing such games - everything is so cool, clean, totally controlled and chess-like it doesn't really seem like combat. ToEE was actually decent - one of very few TB systems I enjoyed (alongside D:OS) but it's still below even BG for me personally, despite being more mechanically complex. I actually never finished ToEE either - got bored when my characters hit level cap halfway through the dungeon.
I much prefer BG combat over PoE - but that's pretty much because it's functional where PoE is broken unless you micromanage everything.
BG combat is far, far from perfect - but if you pick the right scripts then 90% of all combats are quite doable with minimal input. That said, if you want to do stealth stuff and backstab - that's no longer true.
But, in BG, once you're level 3 or something - you can focus on exciting fights for micromanagment, and you can let the characters deal with trash fights with only the occasional control from the player. This is exactly how it should be, in my opinion.
Unfortunately, this doesn't work in PoE with a full party and above easy mode combat. You're constantly fighting the system instead of the enemies.
To me, that's just abysmally bad design in a game that largely revolves around combat. Inexcusably bad.
Unless, again, you actually enjoy constant micromanagment - which I guess most of the PoE fans enjoy.
In terms of the entertainment value of progression, I'd agree that PoE is superior to BG by quite a margin, but that's still only in a theoretical fashion because the actual combat system is so horribly unwieldy and messy. But the amount and diversity of skills and powers is much greater in PoE.
That said, it doesn't really make much sense for a modern game to emulate ancient D&D systems like 2nd Edition in BG. Obviously, the way to go is a more modern system.
This is where NWN and NWN2 completely and utterly destroy PoE in terms of entertainment value - when it comes to character progression. I'm a huge fan of 3rd Edition D&D - particularly when it comes to multiclassing - and I don't think Sawyer's weak vision with PoE can hold a candle to so many years of D&D iteration - even if both systems have their own respective flaws.
Now, I love ToEE combat because it's the most accurate representation of D&D combat - but the character progression is missing a lot of stuff from the core material - and it's limited to level 10, so...
Signature/Avatar nuking: none (can be changed in your profile)
You cannot post new topics in this forum You cannot reply to topics in this forum You cannot edit your posts in this forum You cannot delete your posts in this forum You cannot vote in polls in this forum
and still more then 4 days to go. Hopefully it could gather another million at least.
It looks really promising and from what I've seen Obsidian did listen to the fans.
