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 Posted: Sun, 14th Mar 2021 11:25 Post subject: |
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| Posted: Sun, 14th Mar 2021 12:46 Post subject: |
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| vurt wrote: | | Is Desperados 3 such a terrible game for example, did they trick the fans to appeal to the "mass market"? |
That must have been one of the greatest questions in videogames recently. Because it's so simple yet complex example of how some things change, some remain the same and how... often we don't know what we want.
I might write an article on my next gaming platform about this.
I really, REALLY feel compelled to develop the 'Desperados 3' story... but since this is the Gothic thread I'll just say that...
NO Gothic game that will please the purist / rigid fans will come from any modern AAA company. Have you seen how MANY modern features the Gothic 'Reborn' demo had implemented?! That's saying a lot about modern day creativity, agendas, marketing and change.
And... Do we really know how to make the difference between natural, necessary change and our own imposed nostalgic rigid views?! I wonder... |
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vurt
Posts: 13850
Location: Sweden
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| Posted: Sun, 14th Mar 2021 12:51 Post subject: |
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@TheZor
Music can be a good example, it's like a band getting a new singer who's no one heard, yet some fans might argue the new album sucks (even though its not released or even heard by anyone). It's just not possible to argue with such people, they're just bitter little cunts.
It's one thing if you have solid arguments, like "look, the label has only released this shitty cheesy music and they've obviously forced the band to change in that direction, like so many others". That would be a good argument, you're onto something.
And yes, a new Gothic will include modern elements. Just like ELEX or Risen is also very modern in comparison to Gothic1. Modern elements can be a mixed bag, just like old games are very much a mixed bag when it comes to some things (usually very poor UI, usually not everything is voiced, directions can be more vague).
Like i said before, it will very much come down to 1) will combat suck or not 2) will the game be similar to something like Risen more than something like a low-budget AssCreed, something totally generic.. what we've seen so far it's leaning far more towards something like Risen. You can usually never convert hardcore fans, i mean the ones mentioned above, the stubborn and just totally bitter ones. No real loss.
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| Posted: Sun, 14th Mar 2021 21:36 Post subject: |
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| vurt wrote: | | t has nothing to do with that it's widely different. It has to do with marketing and overall rather low review scores, it's from a small publisher, this matters more than you might think. |
IT has EVERYTHING to do with them being different
This whole argument exist because of that. People here tell you that. Whole Gothic community will tell you that, a lot of people in there despise TES for all its shortcomings in the development and feel of the game-world and gameplay.
| Quote: | | It's been your whole argument, no? |
But the premise and basis completely different, I never said they bought IP just to manipulate community, that's retarded. - nono - One buys IP to profit on it and exploiting community on the way is one of the means to do it. My response was to your statement:
| Quote: | | Someone that actually take interest in the fans |
The only reason there is any interests is to use them, not to appease with faithful product. You implied the latter, which, in turns, implies THQ knows anything about what made Gothic - Gothic. And that's bullshit.
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vurt
Posts: 13850
Location: Sweden
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| Posted: Mon, 15th Mar 2021 10:25 Post subject: |
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| Civ01 wrote: |
But the premise and basis completely different, I never said they bought IP just to manipulate community, that's retarded. - nono - One buys IP to profit on it and exploiting community on the way is one of the means to do it.
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So in other words, manipulation. You've even used that very word to describe it in another post. "exploiting the community" how would this even work? It doesn't. Did you buy Arcania just because it had Gothic in it's name? I sure didn't.
| Quote: |
My response was to your statement:
| Quote: | | Someone that actually take interest in the fans |
The only reason there is any interests is to use them, not to appease with faithful product. You implied the latter, which, in turns, implies THQ knows anything about what made Gothic - Gothic. And that's bullshit. |
Which publisher would be better here than the ones behind Gothic1-3 and such successful follow ups such as Desperados 3 (loved by fans of Desperados 1-2). you claim they will not make a "faithful" Gothic, then who would? What makes you assume they aren't interested in fans. THQ knows enough about Gothic to understand that it has a future, that it has a strong community. Otherwise they wouldnt have bought it. they're smart enough to let the dev team make a demo to see where the acceptance level is, what they can get away with and what they can't, what they have to do to appeal to the fans.
The whole thing is Alex Jones-level conspiracy. "ah so they've released a DEMO! HA! such trickery!", "OH? they ask the FANS what they think? Clever! Such trickery!" and no, i'm not quoting you, but its the gist of it.
And sure, i get it that there are fans of Gothic that doesn't like TES. But it's a small portion i would say. If someone is a fan of the genre itself they will enjoy Risen, Elex, Skyrim, Gothic's, Witcher 3.. they all have their pro's and cons.
Last edited by vurt on Mon, 15th Mar 2021 10:54; edited 3 times in total
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| Posted: Mon, 15th Mar 2021 10:33 Post subject: |
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Is it really the "same" publisher? Gothic 1-3 was published by JoWood. All of the JoWood assets were purchased by Nordic after the former went bankrupt.
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vurt
Posts: 13850
Location: Sweden
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| Posted: Mon, 15th Mar 2021 10:38 Post subject: |
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| Steelone wrote: | | Is it really the "same" publisher? Gothic 1-3 was published by JoWood. All of the JoWood assets were purchased by Nordic after the former went bankrupt. |
you're right, but THQ nordic has still proven they can do great and faithful follow ups on games... no "trickery" involved. Overall a pretty great publisher, many really good titles and this IP is in line with what they seem interested in.
For fun i also looked up Spellforce 3 (havent played, just the second.). From what i can gather its not watered down, fans of the previous two games likes it, many thinks its the best. As a publisher they don't seem to be going in the direction of doing watered down follow-ups or to use something established just to make a quick buck. It's a shitty business model overall because you can really only screw over your customers hard once, and then you've lost the trust and that IP is just worth a LOT less because you've ruined some of its reputation.
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prudislav
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Posts: 29148
Location: The land of beer and porn
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| Posted: Mon, 15th Mar 2021 11:26 Post subject: |
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| Steelone wrote: | | Is it really the "same" publisher? Gothic 1-3 was published by JoWood. All of the JoWood assets were purchased by Nordic after the former went bankrupt. |
they also now own the devs of original Gothics |
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| Posted: Mon, 15th Mar 2021 12:38 Post subject: |
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Well the combat system shown in this remake can take a hike
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Ke1N
Posts: 2403
Location: Bulgaria
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| Posted: Mon, 15th Mar 2021 21:35 Post subject: |
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vurt
Posts: 13850
Location: Sweden
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| Posted: Mon, 15th Mar 2021 22:03 Post subject: |
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| Quote: |
Features:
Faithful full remake of the original Gothic 1
Modernized combat system that takes the basic premises of the original combat system to the modern age
Return to The Colony, in a full blow remake of the popular and revolutionary game Gothic from 2001. Rediscover the world of the mining colony, its secrets and challenges
Play as the Nameless Hero – Manage the fate of a lifetime convicted prisoner who must survive in a world of wild animals, creatures and convicts of dangerous reputation. |
with a "soon" release date the screens are disappointing and perhaps worrying, i mean just nature shots? No water is shown, no characters, no animals. The separate Scavenger shot is nice but doesn't look in-game. Nah, i don't get it tbh... edit: ok it has one with 2 characters standing at a fire but to me that looks very edited, i dont know...
"basic premises of the original combat system to the modern age"
will certainly be interesting.. it's not like PB ever managed to really do this after G2.. Risen was "ok" i guess, if they can pull that off and perhaps fix a few of its shortcomings. ELEX was perhaps decent too but it had its problems.
| prudislav wrote: | | Steelone wrote: | | Is it really the "same" publisher? Gothic 1-3 was published by JoWood. All of the JoWood assets were purchased by Nordic after the former went bankrupt. |
they also now own the devs of original Gothics |
Yeah, so ELEX is also under this publisher. So i don't agree that this game will be terrible due to not being able to fund something like a G1 remake or that it would be impossible for the Publisher to grasp what sells these games. It's a much smaller game than Elex in scope so it can be a good game for this dev to start with.. If they are successful they'll give them clearance to continue with the series most likely.
"The final Gothic 1 Remake will also not be a reimagination like the Playable Teaser but rather a full remake." (from a recent forum post from a dev).
It also seems like the screenshots are just some old ones from the teaser that they put up. Kind of lazy and stupid..
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| Posted: Thu, 1st Apr 2021 18:27 Post subject: |
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couleur
[Moderator] Janitor
Posts: 14361
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| Posted: Thu, 1st Apr 2021 18:31 Post subject: |
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| Posted: Thu, 1st Apr 2021 18:56 Post subject: |
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That's how the game would be like if it was made by Ubisoft.
NZXT S340 ELITE : EVGA Z370 FTW / [ Intel i7 8086k @4.0Ghz ][ ASUS TUF RTX 3060 Ti 8GB ][ 16GB G.Skill Trident Z @3200mhz CL16 ][ 128GB Intel760p Series + 1TB Crucial MX500 + 3TB WD RED ][ Thermaltake Toughpower PF1 650W ]
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vurt
Posts: 13850
Location: Sweden
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tonizito
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Location: Portugal, the shithole of Europe.
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| Posted: Thu, 1st Apr 2021 19:19 Post subject: |
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| boundle (thoughts on cracking AITD) wrote: | | i guess thouth if without a legit key the installation was rolling back we are all fucking then |
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couleur
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| Posted: Thu, 1st Apr 2021 20:11 Post subject: |
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| sin317 wrote: |
typical jew comment
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| Posted: Sat, 13th Aug 2022 14:22 Post subject: |
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W123
Posts: 2513
Location: USA
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| Posted: Mon, 15th Aug 2022 19:22 Post subject: |
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You've got to be nuts to remake this game. It's not going to please the fans of the original, and unless they totally Ubi-fy it it's not going to be something casual players would enjoy either. There's no winning. I'm curious to see what they come up with, if it doesn't end up being canceled.
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| Posted: Mon, 15th Aug 2022 19:40 Post subject: ***** |
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*****
Last edited by Areius on Fri, 19th Sep 2025 16:28; edited 1 time in total
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| Posted: Mon, 15th Aug 2022 22:56 Post subject: |
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I like the trailer a lot - it oozes atmosphere.
-=the wandering pillow stuffer=-
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| Posted: Tue, 16th Aug 2022 04:10 Post subject: |
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| W123 wrote: | | You've got to be nuts to remake this game. It's not going to please the fans of the original, and unless they totally Ubi-fy it it's not going to be something casual players would enjoy either. There's no winning. I'm curious to see what they come up with, if it doesn't end up being canceled. |
Maybe it will be a mix, with options to disable quest markers and so on.
They received massive amounts of feedback from the teaser, and said what they would change a lot of things, so as long as they keep true to Gothic staples like the style of writing quests (giving proper directions in the description and populating the world with guide npcs ) I think there's a chance they can pull it off.
| sin317 wrote: |
typical jew comment
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vurt
Posts: 13850
Location: Sweden
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| Posted: Tue, 16th Aug 2022 04:40 Post subject: |
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Looks great, competent. I've been kind of confident since the demo anyways..
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M4trix
Posts: 9291
Location: Croatia, Adriatic coast (I can see ixi from here)
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| Posted: Tue, 16th Aug 2022 04:43 Post subject: |
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Edited.
Last edited by M4trix on Mon, 14th Nov 2022 08:17; edited 1 time in total
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vurt
Posts: 13850
Location: Sweden
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| Posted: Tue, 16th Aug 2022 06:40 Post subject: |
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| M4trix wrote: | | So, we are acshualy left with remastering and remaking. |
Are we? i'd say remakes and remasters are probably 5%, rest is new games, and there are ~hundreds of releases weekly. We are left with more games, which means overall more remasters and remakes too.
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WaldoJ
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Posts: 32678
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| Posted: Tue, 16th Aug 2022 12:33 Post subject: |
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we notice the remakes and remasters due to memberberries more than original games. doesn't hurt recognizing the franchise. the hope is, if remasters/remakes bank that money the franchise can get some fresh air. so maybe more gothics after, more outcasts and whatever else thq is doing.
| Sin317 wrote: | | I win, you lose. Or Go fuck yourself. |
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